Reply to: Parliamentary Debate Tuesday 20th November

[GreenMirror]

(Relevant, honest )

Iain Dale: Brady, not only keeper of the letters, but a dark horse leadership candidate | Conservative Home

Remember the about face of Gauke on DTA?

[jamesbrown]

(Relevant, honest )

Iain Dale: Brady, not only keeper of the letters, but a dark horse leadership candidate | Conservative Home

[MyxALot]

With all due respect - the original question was about the parliamentary process. In my view the debate didn’t lead anywhere - there was enough momentum but Glen was sticking to his ‘story’. So ‘next steps’ remain with the contractors / representative groups e.g LCAG - Judicial Review.

I don’t think it helps anyone to accuse contractors in this forum of being ‘Lazy gits, riding on the coat tails of others....’. There are people here going through extremely tough times, potentially on the brink of suicide, full of dread about their long term financial position. Not knowing who to turn to or trust. People that don’t have the energy to fight.

Please show some respect.

Agree with what you have said but please note that the fight against the LC is being played out over on the LCAG site rather than here, for understandable reasons.

By all means ask questions on here but you will get far more traction over there.

[Boodog]

The idea is to build enough momentum to table an amendment. Lazy gits, riding the coat tails of others and who have not bothered contacting their MP to sign EDM 1239 need to step up now. </rant>

With all due respect - the original question was about the parliamentary process. In my view the debate didn’t lead anywhere - there was enough momentum but Glen was sticking to his ‘story’. So ‘next steps’ remain with the contractors / representative groups e.g LCAG - Judicial Review.

I don’t think it helps anyone to accuse contractors in this forum of being ‘Lazy gits, riding on the coat tails of others....’. There are people here going through extremely tough times, potentially on the brink of suicide, full of dread about their long term financial position. Not knowing who to turn to or trust. People that don’t have the energy to fight.

Please show some respect.

[foobar]

I’m confused about this too. Having watched the debate and read back through the script (available online), MP’s concerns / objections seemed to fall on deaf ears. The bill has been passed so that’s that. I read that LCAG are raising funds for a Judicial Review. Is this the next step?

The idea is to build enough momentum to table an amendment. Lazy gits, riding the coat tails of others and who have not bothered contacting their MP to sign EDM 1239 need to step up now. </rant>

[Boodog]

Thanks Regron. Do you/does anyone know what next steps will be following the discussion? I'm not clued up on Parliamentary Debates, however, one would assume there are going to be action points following a debate.

I’m confused about this too. Having watched the debate and read back through the script (available online), MP’s concerns / objections seemed to fall on deaf ears. The bill has been passed so that’s that. I read that LCAG are raising funds for a Judicial Review. Is this the next step?

[EBTContractor]

Thanks Regron. Do you/does anyone know what next steps will be following the discussion? I'm not clued up on Parliamentary Debates, however, one would assume there are going to be action points following a debate.

[regron]

When will we know the outcome of this discussion? Can someone post the notes? I'm in SE Asia.

You can watch / download here:

https://www.parliamentlive.tv/Event/...e-9506e22903f2

[EBTContractor]

When will we know the outcome of this discussion? Can someone post the notes? I'm in SE Asia.

[DeadDOTAS]

can someone check the above.

Just I am about to use that in a response to a meeting with my MP and some of it has mistakes or doesn't make sense.

I do however appreciate the context and massive effort.

Thank you Graham for raising awareness of this FANTASTIC opportunity and also for everyone making an effort to getting your MP to attend the session.

If you want briefing materials for your MP, sent them them latest LCAG press releases please:
News - Loan Charge Action Group

In particular this one:
LCAG Press Release 6th November 2018 - Loan Charge Action Group

Also, please provide them with a the following link to the LCAG video collection:
Video News - Loan Charge Action Group

More briefing materials area available from LCAG for free - get in touch here:
Contact LCAG - Loan Charge Action Group

General briefing doc is here:
http://lcag.wpengine.com/wp-content/...l-Briefing.pdf

Please also make sure you follow LCAG on
Twitter: @LCAG_2019
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/loa...-action-group/
FaceBook: https://www.facebook.com/Loan-Charge...6797766164348/
and Instagram

Also, please consider joining LCAG as a guest member here:
https://www.hmrcloancharge.info/#signup

and, ideally, please sign up as a full member for a one-off joining fee of £100 - this pays for the political / campaign work.

Further, given it's last chance saloon time, pls consider contributing to LCAG's legal challenge / judicial review of the Loan charge here:
https://www.hmrcloancharge.info/judicial-review/

Finally, people who missed the lobbying day should try hopping along next week Tuesday to the House of Commons.
More infos via the contact page (see further up).

Become the "A" in LCAG - now!

[lowpaidworker]

Further to my initial post, I suggest that the following briefing note, cut and pasted to your MP, tonight or tomorrow might not be a bad idea.

Dear [MP]

I'd like to draw your attention to a debate happening in the House of Commons on 20th November.

This debate is to discuss the effects of the loan charge upon tens of thousands of contractors who have already suffered ill health, family breakup, divorce, financial ruin, emptying of pension funds and worse as a result of HMRC's administrative incompetence and incoherent and unexplained policy towards contractors.

Whilst I applaud HMRC efforts to eliminate evasion and the black economy and fraud within the tax system, I find that application of the draconian powers available the agency (more than 100 new powers in the last 5 years) to avoidance - and more particularly the attitude that legal avoidance should be placed into the same category as evasion and the like, to be several steps beyond what would constitute a reasonable response.

Most contractors who used what HMRC choose to call an avoidance scheme but only 10 years after they were freely available, has no idea that they were transgressing a law that they were unaware even existed. Indeed laws still do not exist making any of their actions illegal even though HMRC has persuaded Ministers to make statements that avoid leading to perjury accusations only by dint of Parliamentary Privilege.

If HMRC has not been silent when such arrangements were first used; if they had not made a mess of IR35 in 1999 (and promise to repeat in 2020); if they had actually applied their considerable resource to contacting and advising contractors of their views in 2002 or 2004 or 2010 or 2012 or even 2016, most would not now be facing the direst of consequences.

I urge you to take part in this debate and ask difficult questions.

I urge you to push for an independent inquiry into the treatment of contractors by HMRC, to support those already being undertaken by the TSC (2 inquiries) and the Ecomonic Affairs Committee in the Lords.

HMRC is intent on destroying the careers and lives of highly skilled, hard working, family men and women in an effort to cover up their own inadequacies. This cannot be a sensible position for the Government's tax gathering agency to take. I fear that the shift in HMRC's "mission" that occurred a few years ago, moving from "managemnt of the tax system" to "maximising revenue", has been taken all too literally by certain elements within the organisation. Allowed to continue without oversight and accountability, HMRC will lose the trust of a generation.

I would be happy to supply more information.

can someone check the above.

Just I am about to use that in a response to a meeting with my MP and some of it has mistakes or doesn't make sense.

I do however appreciate the context and massive effort.

[ChimpMaster]

I have written to my MP with Graham's template (thank you) but amended to replace "contractors" with "services professionals, teachers, nurses and doctors" where I feel it adds more interest to the MPs.

[here4beer]

Agree, this is great work from LCAG and all those publicly pushing against the Loan Charge. I will be contacting my MP with your email, Webberg, adjusted slightly as I voted for my MP so will add a veiled threat that I am considering my options at election time if he will not contribute to this debate, or does not have a very good reason why not. He has already refused (as a Gov minister) to support the EDM for party political reasons.

We should now all flood our MPs with details of this debate, in particular our stance on it, as the Commons, and the general public need to know the facts about how this is affecting lives, and not just the rhetoric and misinformation of the likes of Mel Stride, Philip Hammond et al.

My MP's PA has replied already, so it's a good start here.

[Dmac]

Great work - flood your MPs with requests for support of the debate

Agree, this is great work from LCAG and all those publicly pushing against the Loan Charge. I will be contacting my MP with your email, Webberg, adjusted slightly as I voted for my MP so will add a veiled threat that I am considering my options at election time if he will not contribute to this debate, or does not have a very good reason why not. He has already refused (as a Gov minister) to support the EDM for party political reasons.

We should now all flood our MPs with details of this debate, in particular our stance on it, as the Commons, and the general public need to know the facts about how this is affecting lives, and not just the rhetoric and misinformation of the likes of Mel Stride, Philip Hammond et al.

[PeterF]

Graham, many thanks for this and your continued efforts in general. I will send this to my MP this evening.