Reply to: Developing in C++

[VectraMan]

Nothing wrong with Python if you want to teach programming.

There is because Python doesn't have static types (it also makes whitespace significant ignoring the principles of virtually every other programming language). Can you imagine letting some young, fresh faced graduate who's only experienced dynamic languages loose on some C++, or Java or C# for that matter? His first question will be "what does int mean?".

Whereas somebody who's done C++ is not going to struggle to pick up simpler languages. If university is for anything it's for giving students a wide range of knowledge, even if most go on to use a narrow subset of that for the actual business of earning a living.

[d000hg]

Fair comment, but...

...won't some of those dinosaurs be retiring soon, creating a skills shortage?

How many school kids & recent graduates do you think would be bothered making the effort to learn C++ rather than just going down the C# route?

For people in their 30s, C++ is still mainstream enough that you'll have to wait 10-20 years for them to retire.

What do graduates learn these days? For a while it was all Java, and that contributed massively to the rise of Java - Java became more popular and C++ declined because Java was all that new graduates knew. Maybe these days they're learning Python.

Nothing wrong with Python if you want to teach programming. However I think it's still a mix and varies a lot from place to place. C++ & native code is making something of a comeback driven by iOS development (and Windows phone to a smaller degree) and is still the mainstay of the non-casual games industry so they are going to be teaching C++ to some degree for the foreseeable future.

I'd suggest one would be better learning Python or several niche languages than C++... fewer gigs but fewer people. All this big-data crap is the rage so why don't you learn node.js?

[darmstadt]

What do graduates learn these days? For a while it was all Java, and that contributed massively to the rise of Java - Java became more popular and C++ declined because Java was all that new graduates knew. Maybe these days they're learning Python.

Well my son who is studying Informatik here has to do the majority of his coursework in C++ although they do touch on other languages. When he was at school they were using Pascal...

[MyUserName]

*I kid you not, some of them can't cope with printf.

*Bangs head on desk*

[MyUserName]

What do graduates learn these days? For a while it was all Java, and that contributed massively to the rise of Java - Java became more popular and C++ declined because Java was all that new graduates knew. Maybe these days they're learning Python.

I wish they would just learn to program. Use C or something that does not hold your hand and face up to the face that programming is difficult to do well because you cannot always rely on fancy tools to do the job for you!

[VectraMan]

Virtually none but it seems to have been that way for several years as far as I am aware. Courses offer C# etc because it is what people want to learn because it is a newer technology that seems to have a lot of jobs going in it. C++ is more difficult to learn, harder to use and is perceived as being out of date.

What do graduates learn these days? For a while it was all Java, and that contributed massively to the rise of Java - Java became more popular and C++ declined because Java was all that new graduates knew. Maybe these days they're learning Python.

[MyUserName]

How many school kids & recent graduates do you think would be bothered making the effort to learn C++ rather than just going down the C# route?

Virtually none but it seems to have been that way for several years as far as I am aware. Courses offer C# etc because it is what people want to learn because it is a newer technology that seems to have a lot of jobs going in it. C++ is more difficult to learn, harder to use and is perceived as being out of date.

[MyUserName]

Fair comment, but...

...won't some of those dinosaurs be retiring soon, creating a skills shortage?

How many school kids & recent graduates do you think would be bothered making the effort to learn C++ rather than just going down the C# route?

I won't be retiring for about 30 years - I seem to be slightly young for a C++ developer so the rest will probably be 5-10 years ahead of me and be retiring in 20 - 25 years.

I would not imagine there will be a C++ skill shortage soon. Most entry level software jobs are being offshored now anyway so even if there was a suddern shortage you will be competing with very cheap software houses that know how to promise the world.

I am not trying to be awkward, I honestly think that especially for C++ the entry level software market in the UK is dead.

Security is doing quite well - does that interest you? They cannot offshore most of that as you have the a British national to get the relevant clearences so it might be more stable too.

[SupremeSpod]

Fair comment, but...

...won't some of those dinosaurs be retiring soon, creating a skills shortage?

How many school kids & recent graduates do you think would be bothered making the effort to learn C++ rather than just going down the C# route?

How are you going to compete with someone who's been developing in C++ for 20+ years?

The simple answer is you're not. You may also find that most good developers enjoy what they do, get paid very well and have no intention of retiring.

[Bwana]

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[MyUserName]

Great stuff!

Would you mind saying what industries & types of applications?

What's your view of the future for C++?

If you don't want to give details on the forum, maybe PM me?

My experience is mostly with Microsoft technologies, so I'd be most likely to go down the Visual C++ route.

Cheers.

I started working in defence, moved into telecoms and eventually found my way into investment banking. I am still there now. Recently I was offered a perm job in broadcasting.

C++ has a good future for the time being provided you are good at it. There are many large systems written in it, the front ends might change to use HTML5, WPF etc but these are relatively easy to pick up if you have a good grounding in programming.

I would not try to enter the industry with C++ as there are too many dinosaurs to compete with. Although to be honest, I would not recommend entering the software industry at all!

[Bwana]

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[MyUserName]

I have been coding in c++ for almost 15 years (not the same program). I am still getting contracts and job offers for it.

[d000hg]

I was talking about the templatyness of regular C++. Someone who was doing C++ with MFC 15 years ago but who hadn't kept up to date would probably find their skills were not much use today.

Still lots of Win32/MFC/ATL/COM projects going strong out there

[OwlHoot]

I'm surprised by this. I'd have thought that with hardware getting more & more (or should that be moore & moore?!) powerful as time goes on, performance would be less and less of an issue? ....

That's what people used to say, and uni lecturers in computing doubtless still do.

But with mobile phone apps, and larger and larger data sets, and 3D graphics etc, the processing often still expands to fill the MIPs, and memory and IO etc, available.