Reply to: Germany versus Britain - shocking statistics

[Sysman]

They've had a website for a long time in Germany, but the online store is more recent.

That's what made me think they were a franchise. The Swiss version came a long time after the German one.

[Sysman]

Pretty much agree. I live in a smaller town (pop. approx. 150,000) but it has all that you really need. Everything from the small specialist shops right up to 2 department stores plus a lot of clothing shops (good tulip as well.) Supermarkets tend to be large stores a bit further out of town as they have been for donkeys years along with all the homeworker type stuff. One of the main differences I think is that most mid-large size German towns and cities don't really have a high street but pedestrianised areas which helps and they also the various different areas of towns tend to have different types of shops.

I'm in a much smaller town (pop. approx. 18,000) and 90% of the main shops are in pedestrianised areas. Lots of clothes and shoe shops and more opticians than you would think the population could support (there are a couple of large engineering companies in town). With a couple of department stores and 3 decent supermarkets you don't need to go out of town unless you want DIY or gardening stuff, and those are available just a few kilometres away.

One of the big differences between the UK and Germany is credit cards, still. Quite a lot of German shops including large stores, such as Media Markt and Saturn, don't take them which allows for a better cash flow but they do tend to allow interest free credit a lot as well. They also hold a lot of stock and have a very good online presence. In fact the latest push by Media Markt is online, in that their online and shop prices are lower than any of the search machines and will also show up as such when searching.

The attitude to credit cards in Switzerland was much like Germany but is changing; a lot of folks still don't use them except for foreign travel or purchases. One department store that I use regularly and the Swiss Railways have been pushing them quite hard for the last 3 or 4 years. In the former case I am sure it is a fair bit to do with customer profiling, in the latter case as a means of buying tickets over t'internet, especially via mobile phones.

That particular department store can often match or beat others on prices of electric goods and they have a 30 day no quibble money back promise, which works very well.

When buying stuff online, the main place I use for computer gear charges extra for credit cards, but provides the ability to pay by e-banking so that's what I do. Free delivery too, so it's a waste of time/petrol money going to the shop.

[formant]

One of the big differences between the UK and Germany is credit cards, still. Quite a lot of German shops including large stores, such as Media Markt and Saturn, don't take them

It's not just the German stores, though. Global chains like Ikea copy that approach in Germany, too.

[formant]

They were well behind the rest of the crowd in getting themselves a web site.

They've had a website for a long time in Germany, but the online store is more recent.

[Sysman]

Media/Technology chains like Media Markt and Saturn still seem to do very well (judging by how busy they are on a day-to-day basis.

For Media Markt this bit of info may be interesting in this context:
"Every store is 10% owned by the store manager. Store managers have discretion as to which products to stock, range, pricing, personnel and material costs."

Interesting. I thought the Media Markt branches here in Switzerland were franchises, but maybe not.

They were well behind the rest of the crowd in getting themselves a web site.

In Switzerland at least they also sell a lot of tat in the hope you don't take it back. More than once I saw computer accessories there, and when I checked them on the internet found that they were obsolete. I don't shop there any more.

[darmstadt]

It's a while since I was in Munich but when I was there just over a year ago they still had some fantastic specialist shops that rival or better any in London for things like homeware, cameras, musical instruments as well as the saturn chain (sort of combined HMV + Comet / Dixons but with a considerably better range i.e. not just focussed on the cheaper stuff) and others such as conrad the like of which we simply don't have here. All supported by a city of only 1.3 million people.

I put it down to a couple of factors. They are quite conservative and prefer physical shops to online, they also value tradition and that things are "made in Germany" and seem to prefer quality to lowest possible price so are less inclined to buy cheap tat made in china to the point that it's hard to even find it in the shops. The specialist shops generally employ people with expertise rather than minimum wagers, and they maintain a good range of physical stock so you can go in, get your hands on something and play with it and take it home that day. The consumers themselves aren't paying as much as a %age of income for housing and generally avoid debt so don't have to service it, which means they have more disposable income, and they seem marginally less inclined to waste it on tat.

Some of the bigger department stores did get into trouble when I was there though.

Waitrose edges it in the supermarket stakes but apart from that, clothing and English language books I'd say that the shops in Munich were better than we have in London.

Pretty much agree. I live in a smaller town (pop. approx. 150,000) but it has all that you really need. Everything from the small specialist shops right up to 2 department stores plus a lot of clothing shops (good tulip as well.) Supermarkets tend to be large stores a bit further out of town as they have been for donkeys years along with all the homeworker type stuff. One of the main differences I think is that most mid-large size German towns and cities don't really have a high street but pedestrianised areas which helps and they also the various different areas of towns tend to have different types of shops.

One of the big differences between the UK and Germany is credit cards, still. Quite a lot of German shops including large stores, such as Media Markt and Saturn, don't take them which allows for a better cash flow but they do tend to allow interest free credit a lot as well. They also hold a lot of stock and have a very good online presence. In fact the latest push by Media Markt is online, in that their online and shop prices are lower than any of the search machines and will also show up as such when searching.

[BA to the Stars]

Yeeeeesssss!

Heinz Wolf.

Er, isn't he sort of Teutonic?

You could say that - Wolff was born in Berlin, but aged 11 he moved to Britain with his family. The family arrived on the day World War II broke out.

[formant]

Media Markt and Saturn are both owned by the same company, Metro who also own (among many other chains) Real (supermarkets) and Kaufhof (similar to Debenhams)

Metro AG are massive globally. Probably why their media and technology stores can afford to remain competitive.

[BA to the Stars]

I'm going to start a Katy Perry thread, a couple of tits I do want to look at.

FTFY

[darmstadt]

Can only speak for Germany (mostly Berlin):
Nope. In fact they're building one new shopping centre after the other. Don't think I've ever spotted a payday-loan shop. Increasing number of 1-EUR shops lately though. Media/Technology chains like Media Markt and Saturn still seem to do very well (judging by how busy they are on a day-to-day basis.

For Media Markt this bit of info may be interesting in this context:
"Every store is 10% owned by the store manager. Store managers have discretion as to which products to stock, range, pricing, personnel and material costs."

In the past I've done remarkably well at negotiating the price of laptops down below online retail competition prices.

Media Markt and Saturn are both owned by the same company, Metro who also own (among many other chains) Real (supermarkets) and Kaufhof (similar to Debenhams)

[doodab]

I just want the title of Engineer to be protected like it is in Germany but I am past caring now on that subject.

As Watt said "I am heartsick of this cursed country"

I'm inclined to agree with you. It seems most unreasonable that anyone can call themselves an engineer whilst companies can trademark everyday words.

[minestrone]

Britain has loads of engineering jobs. Although everyone I know with an engineering degree is either in banking or IT. I do more engineering (electrical) than they do.

I just want the title of Engineer to be protected like it is in Germany but I am past caring now on that subject.

As Watt said "I am heartsick of this cursed country"

[doodab]

As far as I can tell only myself and the welsh wizard have Engineering degrees, 14 pages of trying to work out why Britain does not have any engineering jobs and nobody bothers to involve the formally trained engineers in the discussion.

I'm going to start a Katy Perry thread, a couple of tits I do want to read about.

Britain has loads of engineering jobs. Although everyone I know with an engineering degree is either in banking or IT. I do more engineering (electrical) than they do.

[Robinho]

As far as I can tell only myself and the welsh wizard have Engineering degrees, 14 pages of trying to work out why Britain does not have any engineering jobs and nobody bothers to involve the formally trained engineers in the discussion.

I'm going to start a Katy Perry thread, a couple of tits I do want to read about.

Is it the chicken or the egg though? The bigger the manufacturing industry, the more sense it makes to study the engineering degree.

[mos]

Basically Germany exports 3 times as much as Britain by value, both countries having a similar population (1.5 trillion vs less than 0.5 trillion dollars), also beating the US with a population roughly 4 times greater

As strange as it sounds, the size doesn't matter. Look at Czech Republic - 10 million versus India.