Reply to: Underemployed workers jump by 1m since financial crisis

[escapeUK]

But I imagine with escapeUK, people are glad of the chance to get away.

Hopefully.

[Mich the Tester]

I bet Ive been involved in getting rid of people a lot more than you.

We all believe you. Some of us doubt whether you've ever really achieved anything else.

[d000hg]

But I imagine with escapeUK, people are glad of the chance to get away.

[escapeUK]

It's not as easy to sack people nowadays you have to follow the process of being informal first and then the formal approach.

I bet Ive been involved in getting rid of people a lot more than you. Its really easy, you just need to be seen to follow a reasonable written procedure that everyone is aware of. I assume you are referring to verbal and written warnings. If the company considers the incident to be serious enough you can start with written warning and you can dismiss instantly in certain circumstances, for instance looking at porn on a works computer. I had one of those. I also had one using gambling websites, dismissed no warnings.

[d000hg]

I'd hardly call it a slave wage

I've known plenty of companies to say that but they've still not been able to enforce it, are you going to sack 80% of your staff?

If 80% of the staff spend all day on their iPads then yes
Otherwise, just one to send a message.

Banks often ban people bringing in their own laptops, etc, do they find 80% of people do it anyway or do they obey the rules?

It's not as easy to sack people nowadays you have to follow the process of being informal first and then the formal approach.

If you have a fomal policy and people break it then you can - sure you have to issue warnings but you warn lots of people and then formally discipline one or two, and sack one if you have to.

[The Spartan]

It never works like that, like heads on poles it only takes one or two for the rest to get the message and conform. You can combine it with sacking the ones you wanted rid of too for a win win situation.

It's not as easy to sack people nowadays you have to follow the process of being informal first and then the formal approach.

[original PM]

also just because i have a browser open it does not mean i am actually using it does it - i often have a few windows minimised whilst i work on whatevcer i am working on - maybe dipping into the odd website for 5 minutes an hour to give my head some time to float.

[escapeUK]

Actually, all those things happened and we made a profit, which is at least one thing we did better than now.

Come on, make the connection, you are almost there.

It's a very good point back in the day people were still running their social lives in work - but that was on a face to face basis with people they worked with as opposed to virtual friends on facespace or whatever it is

But the difference is as has been said already is one of transparency. People cant ring their friends at work and appear to be working, or read the paper or whatever. Sitting at your desk on the computer its very easy to appear to be hard at work while surfing James Villas.

[original PM]

Sure.

Everyone worked so much harder before t'internet. Nobody read the papers or a novel at work, nobody (except my boss) kept half a bottle of whiskey in his drawer, nobody ever went for a good long dump and took the paper with him, male and female staff never met up in the copier room for a bit of extra curricular, and absolutely nobody ever dozed off at his desk. Actually, all those things happened and we made a profit, which is at least one thing we did better than now.

It's a very good point back in the day people were still running their social lives in work - but that was on a face to face basis with people they worked with as opposed to virtual friends on facespace or whatever it is

[Mich the Tester]

Its a relatively recent thing you know internet on everyone's computer, 12 years ago ish it was unheard of. People got on with running the business and doing their job then, rather than their social lives.

Sure.

Everyone worked so much harder before t'internet. Nobody read the papers or a novel at work, nobody (except my boss) kept half a bottle of whiskey in his drawer, nobody ever went for a good long dump and took the paper with him, male and female staff never met up in the copier room for a bit of extra curricular, and absolutely nobody ever dozed off at his desk. Actually, all those things happened and we made a profit, which is at least one thing we did better than now.

[original PM]

Its a relatively recent thing you know internet on everyone's computer, 12 years ago ish it was unheard of. People got on with running the business and doing their job then, rather than their social lives.

I think people were just bogged down with much tedium and drudgery which has slowed been transitioned to computers to do...

problem is you cannot reaplce the people as they all have different skills

in essence people have moved away from doing huge amounts of repetitive tasks to managing computers to do huge amounts of repetitive tasks....

don't get me wrong a few motivated people with the right skills set can achieve great things -- it is just that is not how any large business works..

[escapeUK]

permiedom is 10% productivity and 90% bollo<k juggling - taking away the internets will just drive people crazy

Its a relatively recent thing you know internet on everyone's computer, 12 years ago ish it was unheard of. People got on with running the business and doing their job then, rather than their social lives.

I'd hardly call it a slave wage

I've known plenty of companies to say that but they've still not been able to enforce it, are you going to sack 80% of your staff?

It never works like that, like heads on poles it only takes one or two for the rest to get the message and conform. You can combine it with sacking the ones you wanted rid of too for a win win situation.

[The Spartan]

Apart from with your eyes. A company can easily say you may not use your mobile at your desk, and cannot use personal devices for internet access during working hours. True you can't rely on automated software to detect illicit usage but it's not hard to see someone using an iPad.


Anyway, back to mocking your wage slave status...

I'd hardly call it a slave wage

I've known plenty of companies to say that but they've still not been able to enforce it, are you going to sack 80% of your staff?

[Gibbon]

Because I resigned to become a contractor and treble my income? Maybe we know why you will always be a tester, as you arent intelligent enough to actually make anything yourself.

I think that makes you the arrogant odious toad.

[original PM]

Because I resigned to become a contractor and treble my income? Maybe we know why you will always be a tester, as you arent intelligent enough to actually make anything yourself.



In a way yes, but people sat using their phones or tablets really stick out. People are employed to use their computer so it doesnt draw attention.

Yes but you make the basic incorrect assumption that staff are actually there to work 7.5 hours a day when in fact they are there to make middle managament di<k wad feel important so they will be happy to keep licking the clinkers off their bosses arse

permiedom is 10% productivity and 90% bollo<k juggling - taking away the internets will just drive people crazy