Reply to: Other contractors

[el duder]

..

this is an interesting thread. that has brought up some very interesting issues in light of handovers on project work.

i personally feel, that it is within my role to deliver a good, honest, open service to the client.

therefore if someone else comes onto the project to take up work, then i would provide a handover without doubt. Especially if the work was being completed on internal bespoke systems within the organisation.

agreed, this would not be done for free. so i would agree something with the client.

i see it as the clients responsibility to act fairly and openly with the contractor. there is nothing wrong with them bringing in cheaper labour if you have completed your contract. however, if they terminate you to do so, then morally and ethically this is wrong.

i do not see this as a lack of skills on part of the person coming onto the project. he was probably hired on a lower job spec/role, this doenst mean he isnt self employed, it just means he could be taking up a different role on the project using the system you have been implementing.

it has nothing to do with his experience.

just cause we are contractors does not mean we cannot be team players. there has to be a degree of getting on in the work place, working within teams, and building relationships without affecting our status as self employed labour.

its the nature of large business today.

[ClarissaG]

If you're still being paid by the client, I don't really see what the problem is. I could understand your gripe if you were being asked to provide the info in your own time, but does it really matter if you spend an afternoon talking to someone about your work as opposed to just doing the work?

Maybe I've missed something, but your work should be well documented in any case. It has to be maintainable, surely?

[vetran]

do what you have contracted for no more.

I'd ask the client to pay for training time (which you have done and they refused), sit politely and ignore the requests for training you owe the replacement nothing! Ensure there is an acceptable level of documentation - i.e. what you can manage in the short period available and a suitable calibre of replacement could understand, make sure you can make it sound simple to the client.

Then politely inform the client its their own funeral and wish them luck, leave your card and move to pastures new.

I did this twice due to clients cost cutting at high levels and whole teams were going (so it wasn't just me), both times it went horribly wrong once my watch was over and I ended up charging a fortune to fix basic errors.

I even sent my mate into one to clear one cock up they had made, he read the documentation in front of them (as he was told to do) and fixed the problem their numpty didn't have a clue about.


One I can't work for any more as they are a competitor of my current employer and the other is about to pay my holiday spending money again - happy days are here again!

[Dundeegeorge]

I don't quite see the problem

This is all really very simple.
Tell him (face to face) your still negotiating with the client to get some dedicated time to do a full and proper handover to him. Where you shall reveal all the work secrets for the task at hand.

In the meantime do your usual work. If he asks the client about it and the client asks you "Why did you tell him that? " then you can say, "Well I have been meaning to renegotiate what we talked about earlier". Then attempt to do it again.

If the contractor says "What happened to that handover?" you can reply that you are still in renegotiations.

You can stall both of them this way for months! The new guy if he’s smart will not constantly ask the client about it as it makes him look stupid. If he does he only prompts the client to ask you about it again and you start renegotiating once again. And you tell the new guy the client did not seem impressed he was being bugged about this.

If he does not you can fob him of forever with your standard excuse. That way the onus is on the client to attach worthy importance (meaning money to you) of a handover to the new contractor. This way the client becomes the bad guy and not you.

"I would of course help you, but the client has not approved the handover time yet so, we are still waiting".

The client will be more impressed with you as even this new contractor seems to rely upon you. No doubt the new guy will ask "Can you not do this in your own time?". At which point you can fob him again with "No, I need that to do the current work and work on my next contract, that’s why I asked for the dedicated time of course”.

Or you could say, "Sure, but I would have to charge you, otherwise the client would not bother to allocate the dedicated time we are after".

See how it goes?

So this new contractor wants to hire you to handover and train him in the system. Tell him your rate and if he doesn't want to pay it, he can pick it up himself.

[LazyFan]

Solution

This is all really very simple.
Tell him (face to face) your still negotiating with the client to get some dedicated time to do a full and proper handover to him. Where you shall reveal all the work secrets for the task at hand.

In the meantime do your usual work. If he asks the client about it and the client asks you "Why did you tell him that? " then you can say, "Well I have been meaning to renegotiate what we talked about earlier". Then attempt to do it again.

If the contractor says "What happened to that handover?" you can reply that you are still in renegotiations.

You can stall both of them this way for months! The new guy if he’s smart will not constantly ask the client about it as it makes him look stupid. If he does he only prompts the client to ask you about it again and you start renegotiating once again. And you tell the new guy the client did not seem impressed he was being bugged about this.

If he does not you can fob him of forever with your standard excuse. That way the onus is on the client to attach worthy importance (meaning money to you) of a handover to the new contractor. This way the client becomes the bad guy and not you.

"I would of course help you, but the client has not approved the handover time yet so, we are still waiting".

The client will be more impressed with you as even this new contractor seems to rely upon you. No doubt the new guy will ask "Can you not do this in your own time?". At which point you can fob him again with "No, I need that to do the current work and work on my next contract, that’s why I asked for the dedicated time of course”.

Or you could say, "Sure, but I would have to charge you, otherwise the client would not bother to allocate the dedicated time we are after".

See how it goes?

[meridian]

Again, I'll reiterate - shouldn't your code/app be documented as part of your development anyway?

If the other developer's any sort of contractor, as soon as you're out the door he'll be blaming you for anything not working right and for it taking twice as long to fix, "because the other guy wasn't as good as he thought he was and left code dangling all over the place for me to find and fix"

[Clownio]

i can't believe you got a bite with that, clownio...

No neither could I ! !

There's one born every minute eh?

Ho Hum .............better go, as that internet is not going to surf itself.

[Churchill]

I'm coming to the end of my contract after my customer exercised his consumer rights and went back into the free market and found themselves a cheaper contractor.

I had already turned down a rate cut (and bear no grudges) and happy to walk. The other contractor has holes in their skillset which probably explains the lower rate. Also the customer doesn't value technical skills and thinks any idiot off the street could do what we do.

Which brings me to my point. The other contractor has asked for full documentation and a training session off me. I have made a counter proposal that I could spend 5 days as a technical author then 5 days as a trainer and hence get 2 weeks extra revenue. The customer knocked this down as they are already counting the pennies.

The other contractor is still moaning about my "lack of help" and wants me to spend my last weeks helping him settle in. He also states that if the situation was reversed he would "go out of his way to help".

I feel I am totally in the right. This separates the businesses from the bum on seat guys. I know where he is coming from but it's worth 2 weeks pay to me.
As he also reads this forum, which side are you on ?

I'd've sacked you too!

[Mordac]

I have delivered everything as per contract and happy to leave. Customer is happy for me to leave. The only person who isn't is the other guy who has the attitude, "Sorry you're leaving but be professional and give me everything you've got AND train me before you go. I would if I was in your position."

Cheeky fecker. If he's a contractor he's supposed to know what he's doing. I think we've established why he's so cheap. Let him die on his arse, and offer to quote for fixing everything he fecks up.

[BillHicksRIP]

i can't believe you got a bite with that, clownio...

Heheheheheh.

[funkyd]

Just leave and on your way out give him your business card. If he gets stuck he knows who to call.

If he can't get a grip of things then he isn't fit to be a contractor. What is it exactly that is so hard for him to work out?

If I was him I would keep quiet and when you've left simply factor in some learning time into the projects - be a bit creative with the project plans. Nobody likes a contractor who when they turn up starts bitchin - he should be a pro and just get on with it.

FFS!

[Xenophon]

don't
that's
a lot
you're

Oh, and Clownio wasn't being serious.

[scotspine]

i can't believe you got a bite with that, clownio...

[Defamator]

Clownio - so you dont know your arse from your elbow - need I say more.............. stop friggin winging and go cry in the toilet - blady hell......



ok, I'm off for a coffee to ponder about what sort of contractors exist in the UK - alot of you have no balls - cannot make decisions - generally bitch about others.

Hence, thats why your on £350/ day and I am on £700...........


Sorry, just had to say this............ twats.........

[BillHicksRIP]

Tip him a wink with the line, "It's nothing personal. It's just business.".