Reply to: QE knocks further £90bn off pension funds

[Churchill]

Try doing it after divorce!

You have a point!

In fact 10 points to Scourer!

[BrilloPad]

Try doing that on an average salary...

Try doing it after divorce!

[Churchill]

Wisest course, as always, IS to have a pension. AND savings in cash/stocks in your ISA. AND a property or two, with no mortgage.

In the decades until I reach pension/retirement age, I expect all 3 things to go wrong at least once so I don't even try to predict which is best, and plonk money towards all of them.

Try doing that on an average salary...

[d000hg]

Wisest course, as always, IS to have a pension. AND savings in cash/stocks in your ISA. AND a property or two, with no mortgage.

In the decades until I reach pension/retirement age, I expect all 3 things to go wrong at least once so I don't even try to predict which is best, and plonk money towards all of them.

[scooterscot]

Property owners have got off lightly because the government/BOE have bent-over-backwards not only to inflate their assets (house prices) but also to keep the bubble inflated, and further still... to protect them from repossessions, all accomplished, at least partly, by a long-term extremely low interest rate. Also the tax situation has been favourable for property owners. Mass uncontrolled immigration has also helped to increase prices and prop-up demand.

That argument does not represent the majority of people in the country. Geographically prices are not inflated in the north like they are in the south.

If someone got suckered into buying a wimpy new build for £400k+ that's their problem not the government's.

Lastly what do you expect from a capitalist party at the helm? Property and tories go together like roast and cranberry sauce.

This mass uncontrolled immigration bring £400K with them for their new home? Last report I saw they were living in converted garages in Wandsworth.

Compare all that with pensions... hit by the dividend-tax-credit raid, bashed around by a stockmarket that went nowhere in 10 years ("the lost decade") because money was going into property (and bankers pockets) instead. Stockmarket returns (and therefore many pension fund values) have also been adversely affected by the fat-cat culture that governments have allowed, enabling executives to cream off a lot of profit that should have gone to shareholders (pension fund owners) in the form of dividends. Gilts have been affected by QE which has hammered annuity rates leaving those unfortunate enough to be retiring at the moment a lot worse off for the rest of their lives.

Just because it may be easy to raid pensions doesn't make it right. It's easy to attack someone who is vulnerable, but that doesn't make it right!

Completely agree - so it is hardly a prudent course of action to pay into a pension.

Which is a real real shame. I want an income when I retire and I'll do what I can to make sure that happens. I'll select a product (or country!) where the government's sticky fingers cannot reach.

Considering the current situation, I can't blame people for thinking that BTL may be a better option than a pension. However, the property boom has been going on for a long time now. I can't help but wonder whether it is headed for a fall. The government/BOE may be falling over themselves trying to prop-up the housing market, but even they are not in total control. Nobody is above the market. Companies (shares) make new products, services etc, but what value does a house add? Someone could live in it 30 years ago, and someone could live in it now. What has been gained?

Actually there's a whole lot of banks in London who made a whole lot of nothing and profited billions from it. Understand that if you will I don't.

Humans have gained in numbers. Lots of them. Yeap, there's another one just came alone. Your house need not do anything, it's value is linked by the demand of those who would like to sleep under a roof.

For those that can't they're forever slaves to their landlords. As long as our numbers keep gaining our house values shall keep rising. Lovely. Oh but your salary might not, which I might add has nothing to do with the value of property, not one iota.

[d000hg]

Indeed. Even mortgage interest can be offset against tax.

Only on that property's income though (or maybe across all your properties, I only have 1)... you can't offset costs on your BTL against income from contracting.

[AtW]

In the end, whether people choose BTL or pensions, there are risks involved either way.

Problem with pension is that it will be devalued due to money printing, can and will be robbed by successive Govts, and ultimately one might die before being able to claim it. Can pensions even get inherited?

So owning property makes sense, unless it is located in Wandsworth where every kebab shop tuliphole flat is worth over £2 mln which will make it liable for super rich LibDem tax.

HTH

[Bwana]

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[AtW]

Divorcee.

BS, divorcee won't have so much money left and would be counting every penny, probably living rough on street - at least that's what BrilloPad told me...

[MarillionFan]

And who'd pay 6 months in advance? Either very stupid person or somebody who does not like credit checks?

Divorcee.

[hyperD]

"rampart inflation" appears to be a fading memory the older I get.

[AtW]

My BTL is getting let on the 16th. The person renting is paying all six months in advance (for some reason).

And who'd pay 6 months in advance? Either very stupid person or somebody who does not like credit checks?

[scooterscot]

My BTL is getting let on the 16th. The person renting is paying all six months in advance (for some reason). Result.

I had the same thing happen last year, nice little wod sitting in the account.

[scooterscot]

The thing is... if BTL is becoming more and more popular as an alternative to a pension, how long before governments/BOE start to target that as their piggy-bank rather than raiding pensions? Seems like so far... the BTL brigade (& property-owners in general) have got off very lightly in terms of being shafted by tax/economic-policy. How long will that situation last?

Why have we 'got off lightly'? A rightly owned and purchased for asset. The government sold off council housing, they cannot blame private investors for the mistakes the government made in the past.

The wod of pension cash sits in one pot, easy for the government to raid. At least with a privately held asset the sticky fingers of the government are limited.

[BrilloPad]

The thing is... if BTL is becoming more and more popular as an alternative to a pension, how long before governments/BOE start to target that as their piggy-bank rather than raiding pensions? Seems like so far... the BTL brigade (& property-owners in general) have got off very lightly in terms of being shafted by tax/economic-policy. How long will that situation last?

Indeed. Even mortgage interest can be offset against tax.

And its a great pity for people struggling to get on the housing ladder.