Reply to: So just back from a week in North Rhine Westphalia ...

[darmstadt]

Carl Cox is English.

Techno (in the original sense) and particularly house owe as much to disco and funk as to kraftwerk, and originated in Detroit & Chicago respectively. The late 80s / early 90s techno explosion was actually a global thing with the Belgians, Dutch and British just as important as the Germans, more so early on, and of course one should give credit to the various DJs in Ibiza who popularised the music to foreign holiday makers pilled out of their heads.

The "seminal" German tracks from hardfloor, age of trance, dj hell and so on were actually released on the Belgian record label R&S around 1990 and there are plenty of other tracks from the US, Belgium and the UK that predate those considerably (stuff from Kevin Saunderson, Juan Atkins, Derrick May, Joey Beltram, Orbital and so on).

I'm not saying the Germans didn't do their bit ("I feel love" was recorded in Munich don't you know), but "invented" is going a bit far.

They do have a thriving boutique gadget scene though, especially in Berlin, they make some top notch machines

WYS. I meant May, Atkikns and Saunderson. If you read some of the interviews with these guys way back in the late 80's (remember Cybertron with Atkins started around '85) their primary influences were groups like Kraftwerk (in turn also influenced not only by people like Boulez and Stockhausen but also soul) and their ilk. It was the mixing of the, reasonably, two disparate types of music which lead to most dancefloor rythmns you'll be hearing today. Stuff like hardfloor and trance came a bit later and also that scary tulip from Rotterdam called 'Gabba.' 'I Feel Love' was mixed by Giorgio Moroder wasn't it?

I can remember doing warehouse parties in London in the late 80's and hearing some of this stuff for the first time and then going onto the M25 ring parties where it all started to go all a bit Pete Tong.

[shaunbhoy]

Well I can understand that for the lower social classes and awkward geeks, German night life might feel more welcoming than winking yourself to a standstill in your garden shed in London. Doesn't quite do it for me I'm afraid - there are more interesting pubs and clubs in Shoreditch or South West London than any number of German cities.

HTH, BIDI.

FTFY

[minestrone]

German 'disco' is actually not bad if you like it. There are of course the really crap ones but there are many good clubs, remember this is the country that basically invented the modern (by that I mean late 80's to early 90's) dance revolution. Without the US DJs like Carl Cox stumbling upon bands such as Kraftwerk there would be no Techno from which there would be no House, etc.

In fact you can blame the Germans for the birth of pop music as we know it. If it wasn't for clubs like the Star Club in Hamburg and the many little clubs in towns where US GIs were based there would be no modern rock and roll.

Well I enjoyed reading it...

...but it is total rubbish.

[doodab]

German 'disco' is actually not bad if you like it. There are of course the really crap ones but there are many good clubs, remember this is the country that basically invented the modern (by that I mean late 80's to early 90's) dance revolution. Without the US DJs like Carl Cox stumbling upon bands such as Kraftwerk there would be no Techno from which there would be no House, etc..

Carl Cox is English.

Techno (in the original sense) and particularly house owe as much to disco and funk as to kraftwerk, and originated in Detroit & Chicago respectively. The late 80s / early 90s techno explosion was actually a global thing with the Belgians, Dutch and British just as important as the Germans, more so early on, and of course one should give credit to the various DJs in Ibiza who popularised the music to foreign holiday makers pilled out of their heads.

The "seminal" German tracks from hardfloor, age of trance, dj hell and so on were actually released on the Belgian record label R&S around 1990 and there are plenty of other tracks from the US, Belgium and the UK that predate those considerably (stuff from Kevin Saunderson, Juan Atkins, Derrick May, Joey Beltram, Orbital and so on).

I'm not saying the Germans didn't do their bit ("I feel love" was recorded in Munich don't you know), but "invented" is going a bit far.

They do have a thriving boutique gadget scene though, especially in Berlin, they make some top notch machines

[Incognito]

Well I can understand that for the lower social classes and awkward geeks, German night life might feel more welcoming than the more sophisticated fare on offer in London. Doesn't quite do it for me I'm afraid - there are more interesting pubs and clubs in Shoreditch or South West London than any number of German cities.

HTH, BIDI.

I'm sure a night out on the tiles with you is about as interesting as an Eastender's sub-plot.

[sasguru]

Well I can understand that for the lower social classes and awkward geeks, German night life might feel more welcoming than the more sophisticated fare on offer in London. Doesn't quite do it for me I'm afraid - there are more interesting pubs and clubs in Shoreditch or South West London than any number of German cities.

HTH, BIDI.

[shaunbhoy]

I can certainly vouch for Köln and Düsseldorf. I had some great weekends there.

Ditto, although I'd give Duss the edge. sasguru's problem is he lacks the imagination to know how to enjoy himself. If his missus is not there calling the shots he is hopelessly lost for ideas, and as he is such an obnoxious c0ck, nobody else is likely to throw out an olive branch.
He wouldn't know a good time if it sat on his face and wriggled!!

[AlfredJPruffock]

So you saw the Lorelei?

For theater in Bonn maybe your friend should look here

I worked for the German finance ministry in Bonn a couple of years ago and found it quite a pleasant town (does Beethoven ring any bells.) It has a pretty good cultural scene and even an 'Altstadt' although many 'Bonners' don't know about it. Try 'Rhein in Flammen' which is spectacular: fireworks set to classical music set on the Rhein. Foing to the UK to see theater is nothing special, just someone trying to prove a bit of oneupmanship. There is very good theater, opera, etc all over Germany, you just have to go to it.

German 'disco' is actually not bad if you like it. There are of course the really crap ones but there are many good clubs, remember this is the country that basically invented the modern (by that I mean late 80's to early 90's) dance revolution. Without the US DJs like Carl Cox stumbling upon bands such as Kraftwerk there would be no Techno from which there would be no House, etc.

In fact you can blame the Germans for the birth of pop music as we know it. If it wasn't for clubs like the Star Club in Hamburg and the many little clubs in towns where US GIs were based there would be no modern rock and roll.

Having spent a fair amount - indeed too much time in Bonn - I must say I found it deadly dull -once youve seen the Beethoven museum thats as exciting as it gets - mind you - you are only 30 mins ro so on the train to Cologne - far more interesting - altough I still prefer Hamburg,

[Sysman]

Really? Köln closely followed by Düsseldorf and Dortmund have the best nightlife (eating, drinking, dancing, etc.) in Germany. They beat Berlin and München in a recent survey so maybe you were in the wrong place with the wrong people.

I can certainly vouch for Köln and Düsseldorf. I had some great weekends there.

[darmstadt]

Close enough. Spent 2 days in a hotel there before Bonn.



Possibly. My Bonnite friend says no though. He regularly comes to London for the theatre.



No. HTH.
And even if was it would be better than going to a German "disco".

So you saw the Lorelei?

For theater in Bonn maybe your friend should look here

I worked for the German finance ministry in Bonn a couple of years ago and found it quite a pleasant town (does Beethoven ring any bells.) It has a pretty good cultural scene and even an 'Altstadt' although many 'Bonners' don't know about it. Try 'Rhein in Flammen' which is spectacular: fireworks set to classical music set on the Rhein. Foing to the UK to see theater is nothing special, just someone trying to prove a bit of oneupmanship. There is very good theater, opera, etc all over Germany, you just have to go to it.

German 'disco' is actually not bad if you like it. There are of course the really crap ones but there are many good clubs, remember this is the country that basically invented the modern (by that I mean late 80's to early 90's) dance revolution. Without the US DJs like Carl Cox stumbling upon bands such as Kraftwerk there would be no Techno from which there would be no House, etc.

In fact you can blame the Germans for the birth of pop music as we know it. If it wasn't for clubs like the Star Club in Hamburg and the many little clubs in towns where US GIs were based there would be no modern rock and roll.

[Pondlife]

What about Hamburg ?? - I really liked the night life there.

Kiez is as usual but most other places are suffering. Sternchanze is probably the best place to head for if you can't be arsed with the hassle of stag parties and people who've been on it all day. Local bars are v quiet mid week nowadays.

[sasguru]

Yees London Night life sucks nowadays.

Really? all of it?

[sasguru]

Trouble is the Rhine Gorge isn't in Westfalia.

Close enough. Spent 2 days in a hotel there before Bonn.

Trouble is, there is a lot of culture in Germany but you probably can't see it.

Possibly. My Bonnite friend says no though. He regularly comes to London for the theatre.

Trouble is, isn't nightlife in London getting beaten up in a pub by idiots which is staffed by non-UK persons

No. HTH.
And even if was it would be better than going to a German "disco".

[AlfredJPruffock]

Trouble is the Rhine Gorge isn't in Westfalia. Trouble is, there is a lot of culture in Germany but you probably can't see it. Trouble is, isn't nightlife in London getting beaten up in a pub by idiots which is staffed by non-UK persons

What about Hamburg ?? - I really liked the night life there.

Yees London Night life sucks nowadays.

[AlfredJPruffock]

Bit mean. Well known fact that Germans don't have a sense of humour either.

Like Sas.

Now thats not true.

Here is a joke which was doing the rounds in Berlin's bomb shelters in December 1944 -

Be practical this Christmas - give a coffin.

During my stint in the FatherLand, I found that Germans do in fact have a rather subtle sesne of humour - and can laugh at the themselves .