The Smart Grid

[BlasterBates]

When the CEO of the National Grid says on Radio 4:

We keep thinking that we want it to be there and provide power when we need it.

I can't help feeling that when he says this it means, power won't be there when you need it.

or...

“We are going to change our own behaviour and consume it when it is available and available cheaply.”

means you can watch TV when the wind is blowing.

I like the way he dresses this up as a "Smart Grid". What is going to happen is that your house will be controlled by some Engineer at the local Wind Farm, and when the wind drops you get switched off. The other alternative is that a big siren goes off in the cellar to warn you that the price has gone up to £500 per KwH.

[TimberWolf]

But the misery of the public subsidising inefficient 'renewable' tech is ok?

Renewables are heavily subsidised by 'cheap' fossil fuels too. Imagine how expensive wind turbines would be to build if they weren't done with energy and materials derived from fossil fuels. I think the answer is nuclear, go 'Manhattan Project' with Thorium and address the population problem too.

[pjclarke]

In 2008, the International Energy Agency estimated global fossil fuel subsidies at $550 billion, then around $312 billion for 2009. To put it another way, about $50 for every person on the planet. Renewables get around 1/10th this amount.

In the UK the coal production industry alone received over £200 million of your tax money between 2000 and 2008 (Hansard written answer 9 Sep 2010), though this is due to be phased out by 2014 under EU rules.

[Cliphead]

If this is true, it would be just enough to totally crash stock market fueled by energy companies and bankrupt pension funds who invested money into companies like BP. Misery for pensioners all around - but free energy for everyone else

But the misery of the public subsidising inefficient 'renewable' tech is ok?

[AtW]

Thorium promises what uranium never delivered: abundant, safe and clean energy - and a way to burn up old radioactive waste.

If this is true, it would be just enough to totally crash stock market fueled by energy companies and bankrupt pension funds who invested money into companies like BP. Misery for pensioners all around - but free energy for everyone else

[Coalman]

Interesting viewpoint there from 'A conservative view of south east Michigan and beyond', nestling between the 'Blogs for Palin' ads. I am sure that's a verbatim quote there and the author knows everything worth knowing about the ramifications of the UK Smart Grid.

The wind is always blowing somewhere, and the 'smartness' of the grid will come when we use HVDC tech to get our power from where it is being generated, whether this is concentrated solar in North Africa , geothermal in Iceland, hydro in scandanavia or wind and tidal in the UK. All our energy needs can be met from renewables once we make the overdue move away from increasingly rare, obscenely subsidised and filthy fossil fuels.

Have to agree with some of your points there. We need to diversify our power generation capability.

But please provide a link to back up your comments about subsidised fossil fuel generation. Its only the renewable supply that is subsidised at the moment, by our tax money.

Having pointed out that we need to diversify our generation capability, it needs to stand by itself commercially. At the moment none of it does without a significant hike in electricity costs.

For info - I agree that the climate is changing, it has done throughout history, nothing is constant. Is man accelerating change? I'm not convinced.

[Cliphead]

Ooops. No objection to nuclear being part of the mix. Though we don't actually need it and there are local problems - the European supply chain is tight: total European capacity is expected to be flat or in slight decline over the next 15 years, we still haven't sorted out liability, waste disposal or proliferation and there are question marks over its dispatchability.

I wonder if the latest designs are safer and produce less waste or even Thorium based reactors might be the way to go;

Thorium promises what uranium never delivered: abundant, safe and clean energy - and a way to burn up old radioactive waste."With a thorium nuclear reactor, Dean stresses a number of added benefits: there is no possibility of a meltdown, it generates power inexpensively, it does not produce weapons-grade by-products, and will burn up existing high-level waste as well as nuclear weapon stockpiles.

[pjclarke]

Ooops. No objection to nuclear being part of the mix. Though we don't actually need it and there are local problems - the European supply chain is tight: total European capacity is expected to be flat or in slight decline over the next 15 years, we still haven't sorted out liability, waste disposal or proliferation and there are question marks over its dispatchability.

[Cliphead]

Interesting viewpoint there from 'A conservative view of south east Michigan and beyond', nestling between the 'Blogs for Palin' ads. I am sure that's a verbatim quote there and the author knows everything worth knowing about the ramifications of the UK Smart Grid.

The wind is always blowing somewhere, and the 'smartness' of the grid will come when we use HVDC tech to get our power from where it is being generated, whether this is concentrated solar in North Africa , geothermal in Iceland, hydro in scandanavia or wind and tidal in the UK. All our energy needs can be met from renewables once we make the overdue move away from increasingly rare, obscenely subsidised and filthy fossil fuels.

What's wrong with nuclear energy?

[pjclarke]

BS

Interesting viewpoint there from 'A conservative view of south east Michigan and beyond', nestling between the 'Blogs for Palin' ads. I am sure that's a verbatim quote there and the author knows everything worth knowing about the ramifications of the UK Smart Grid.

The wind is always blowing somewhere, and the 'smartness' of the grid will come when we use HVDC tech to get our power from where it is being generated, whether this is concentrated solar in North Africa , geothermal in Iceland, hydro in scandanavia or wind and tidal in the UK. All our energy needs can be met from renewables once we make the overdue move away from increasingly rare, obscenely subsidised and filthy fossil fuels.

[BlasterBates]

A few more details on the Smart Grid that Seve Holliday CEO of National Grid was talking about:

Under the so-called “smart grid” that the UK is developing, the government-regulated utility will be able to decide when and where power should be delivered, to ensure that it meets the highest social purpose. Governments may, for example, decide that the needs of key industries take precedence over others, or that the needs of industry trump that of residential consumers. Governments would also be able to price power prohibitively if it is used for non-essential purposes.

Look forward to candle lit dinners at home when the wind isn't blowing. Should be good fun, unfortunately I won't be in the UK when the Smart Grid will be in operation, but I'll be cheering everyone from the sidelines.

CEO of UK National Grid: “Electricity consumers in the UK will need to get used to flicking the switch and finding the power unavailable” | motorcitytimes.com