Unfortunately RC most people are not Saints and you can't govern society on a pious hope that they will be.
They might come to your aid but in the absence of any actual affinity or common purpose they almost certainly won't. Asylum seekers should be the best and most loyal citizens we have as their gratitude should ensure it. Are they?
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Previously on "Becoming really tired of this country's attitude towards human rights"
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Originally posted by xoggoth View PostWe mostly want to share with those we can emphathise with but if our money and our safety is given away to those who threaten us, who have contributed nothing and sometimes despise us, then we in turn ask why we should bother to contribute.
Because if you help those in need, when they are not your friends, you might find they come to your aid when you think you have no friends left.
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I think you are all being whipped into a frenzy by the Meedja again. They were put on this earth for commercial gain, so watch out for their motives.
Right, I've said my piece - let the mass debating continue....
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Originally posted by Peoplesoft bloke View PostThere are a lot of rights that ought to be guaranteed, but I feel there is scope to take away some for people who offend against society - and a person who is illegally in Britain, who has previous convictions, who drives illegally, injures a child and then doesn't even have the basic human decency to get out and try to help must surely be a candidate to forfeit some of his own "rights" on the basis that he plainly has no respect for the rights of others.
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But when you insist on abstract rights and ignore human nature to that extent you destroy society. Any cohesive society has to be based on shared values and, more importantly, on people's sense of what is fair, a sense which is natural and present even in other primates, it's not some invention of the Daily Mail.
We mostly want to share with those we can emphathise with but if our money and our safety is given away to those who threaten us, who have contributed nothing and sometimes despise us, then we in turn ask why we should bother to contribute.
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Originally posted by Alf W View PostSecond, the guy was tried, convicted and served his sentence 7 years ago. Done, finished. His wife and kids are the ones with Human Rights as well. Blame the UK Immigration people if you must but I can't see it's fair to deport him now.
?
I take the point about the guys family, but surely this woman knew she was taking a chance with him - doesn't anyone accept responsibility for anything these days?
As I understand it the way the Human Rights industry explains giving convicted criminals superior treatment to victims is that it effectively doesn't matter how bad the stuff you do is, there are some rights that can't be taken off you ever, because they are basic. This, as the man with no daughter pointed out, can be perverse - for example, presumably a proflic child abuser can't claim he has a right to a life around children?
There are a lot of rights that ought to be guaranteed, but I feel there is scope to take away some for people who offend against society - and a person who is illegally in Britain, who has previous convictions, who drives illegally, injures a child and then doesn't even have the basic human decency to get out and try to help must surely be a candidate to forfeit some of his own "rights" on the basis that he plainly has no respect for the rights of others.Last edited by Peoplesoft bloke; 17 December 2010, 13:47.
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Originally posted by scooterscot View PostWithout pride and prejudice and not wanting to sound right-wing (I'm anything but)
What would the British press headlines be if this story were in the UK?
Good on the pensioner I say...
Pensioner shoots dead teen intruder - The Local
Instead we have those limp wristed idealists coming out of the woodwork defending people like this..
BBC News - Blackburn death crash driver will not be deported I mean seriously? A man whose family has probably lived here for generations is trumped by this failed asylum seeker? This is wrong.
Throw away the keys for this... why is it even a story.
BBC News - Killer Kearney claims Royal Mail breached human rights
Second, the guy was tried, convicted and served his sentence 7 years ago. Done, finished. His wife and kids are the ones with Human Rights as well. Blame the UK Immigration people if you must but I can't see it's fair to deport him now.
Thirdly, this is massively important. Employers can't just be given carte blanche to sack any of their employees who happen to get charged with something. Loads of people are found innocent
Then that's us 'Lefties' always thinking about the people element eh?
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A week or so ago, NF asked why we were all squabbling over something minor. Cant even remember what it was now.
Anyways, I see this human right malarky in the same way, albeit writ large. I know what happened to the little girl is a massive tradegy for that family, but I take comfort from the fact that if we are arguing about the act, then we dont have much biggers issues, like anhialating each other, to argue about.
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Originally posted by Mich the Tester View PostThen spare us all the low brow crap.
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Originally posted by DodgyAgent View PostSpare me the "high brow" crap.
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Originally posted by Mich the Tester View PostReally, suggesting (explain away the 6 million pairs of shoes) that someone's a holocaust denier because he states that Germany has a good human rights record (granted, record of Federal Republic of Germany since 1945), is a massive Godwin.
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Originally posted by DodgyAgent View PostYou cannot have it both ways.. it all goes with the territory of being a leftie. Perhaps you need to be a bit more honest with yourself these "rights" and "equality" policies are worn proudly by the left.
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