Government urged to reveal 'true' national debt of £4.8 trillion

[AtW]

Maybe, but what sort of person in a position of authority knowing this would carry out the action regardless? What do we call people like that?

Nu Liebor?

[hyperD]

I don't think it was a crushing blow - maybe last straw, but certainly not the root cause.

Maybe, but what sort of person in a position of authority knowing this would carry out the action regardless? What do we call people like that?

[AtW]

However, it is agreed (backed up through an FOI) that despite the warnings given to him by his advisers, McRuin arrogantly cast, in the gaming parlance, the "crushing blow" to pensions in pursuit of supporting his spending sprees.

I don't think it was a crushing blow - maybe last straw, but certainly not the root cause.

The problem of Brown is that he got more or less whole country into debt that will probably only hyperinflation can deal with. Given that pensions will need to be indexed this means it can become a spiral with one debt being devalued but other going up to make up for inflation.

It's no wonder one of the first things Con-Libs did was to use another measure of inflation from arsenal of flawed metrics that they have.

[hyperD]

In fairness to Mr Brown he did not feck up pension system THAT much with his dividend run - it's the increased lifespan that does it, too generous final salary pensions that were not funded properly in the first place and general realiance on stock markets (that can crash) for support of this ponzi scheme.

Never use "fair" and Brown in the same sentence please!

I agree with all what you say, up to a point Alexei: even Tory Lamont cast his greedy eye over the pension funds and tweaked the dividend tax credit back in '93.

However, it is agreed (backed up through an FOI) that despite the warnings given to him by his advisers, McRuin arrogantly cast, in the gaming parlance, the "crushing blow" to pensions in pursuit of supporting his spending sprees.

For this, he will not be forgiven.

[HairyArsedBloke]

In fairness to Mr Brown he did not feck up pension system THAT much with his dividend run - it's the increased lifespan that does it, too generous final salary pensions that were not funded properly in the first place and general realiance on stock markets (that can crash) for support of this ponzi scheme.

Well, there is the answer then.

Some solutions:

• No more medical treatment for the old
• No winter fuel allowances
• Encourage smoking and drinking from an earlier age
• Cut back on health and safety laws

Easy when you think about it.

[AtW]

We did, until that hoon, Gordon "McRuin" Brown looked at his moral compass and decided to remove the dividend tax credit to the tune of about £100b+ because "it was the right thing to do".

In fairness to Mr Brown he did not feck up pension system THAT much with his dividend run - it's the increased lifespan that does it, too generous final salary pensions that were not funded properly in the first place and general realiance on stock markets (that can crash) for support of this ponzi scheme.

[hyperD]

I can see this working...

"Now Mr hyperD, you're 71 years old now with a short, failed career in developing mediocre applications behind you, what makes you think you are the best person to stack shelves in Lidl? Come back! What do you mean you need to change your nappy? You've left your zimmer frame behind..."

[TimberWolf]

Pension age needs to rise to 72, urges think tank - Pensions, Money - The Independent

[doodab]

I think the removal of the dividend tax credit was the final nail in the coffin for private and company pensions, but the end of employer provided final salary pensions started years earlier with the rise of "money purchase" schemes & shift towards providing for ones own retirement (in order to reduce the burdens on corporations) that occurred under Thatcher.

The tax credit had little to do with the state pension I expect as this isn't backed by an investment fund, AFAIK, it's a ponzi scheme.

[Gonzo]

Mark Littlewood, the IEA's director-general, said: "The latest official national debt figure is seriously misleading. Looming in the background are pension liabilities. These should be moved to the forefront.

Not necessarily.

Does anyone have anything in writing about the pension that they are going to get from the state?

I thought not.

[hyperD]

Is my memory playing tricks or did we have the best pension system in Europe in 1997?

We did, until that hoon, Gordon "McRuin" Brown looked at his moral compass and decided to remove the dividend tax credit to the tune of about £100b+ because "it was the right thing to do".

Gordon hoon-ing Brown. The worst chancellor and PM to have ever inflicted the people of the UK with his socialist idiocy. Utter, utter c...

[Doggy Styles]

Is my memory playing tricks or did we have the best pension system in Europe in 1997?

[doodab]

No pension, no liability.

Logan's run, anyone?

[AtW]

The IEA raised its concerns after the latest public finances data from the Office for National Statistics (ONS) this week, which showed that the total debt, excluding bank bail-outs, is £816bn – itself a record high. However, the figures strip out the state's pension liabilities in a contravention of standard accounting practices.

Mark Littlewood, the IEA's director-general, said: "The latest official national debt figure is seriously misleading. Looming in the background are pension liabilities. These should be moved to the forefront.

More here - Government urged to reveal 'true' national debt of £4.8 trillion - Telegraph