Reply to: Tips for moving to Germany?

[BlasterBates]

...hang on there are two separate issues here:

Freelancer vs Gewerbe(business)
Self-employed vs disguised employee

the first is about demonstrating you're an Engineer, ie. a professional as opposd to a blue-collar type to avoid business tax a "Freiberfudler", the second is about proving you're really self-employed, to avoid Social Insurance, 500 EUR a month.

Having business cards not supervised etc etc is about avoiding disguised employment status. This done by the German Pension Authority and not the Finanzamt. You only worry about this after a few years, involves no penalties as it isn't a tax.

The Freelancer thing is to prove that you are an "Engineer". they look at what you do. Complex system programming is considered "Engineer" if you do simple stuff this is not. There is the grey area.

[AlfredJPruffock]

Its already started by the looks of it, Finanzamt vs. British Contractors

[darmstadt]

So when's WW3 due ?

Its already started by the looks of it, Finanzamt vs. British Contractors

[AlfredJPruffock]

Darmstadt of course but working mainly in Bonn for the government at the moment. Actually I'm primarily working for the Finanzamt and Zollamt (both state and states) and some of the information that I hear is quite interesting. I'm also the only foreigner

So when's WW3 due ?

[darmstadt]

Dont know where Darmie is right now and I am near Friedrichshafen.

Darmstadt of course but working mainly in Bonn for the government at the moment. Actually I'm primarily working for the Finanzamt and Zollamt (both state and states) and some of the information that I hear is quite interesting. I'm also the only foreigner

[chef]

There are a few of us out here. Chef in Munich.

Chef has been to Stuttgart

Stuttgart is bloody expensive to rent, Munich is much nicer with more choice IMO

BTW its TLG not LGM

It's in the details

[The Lone Gunman]

Asking some questions on the accounting forum it sounds like being a freelancer isn't so clear cut...



That could potentially make the take from a Client Co's contract pretty poor (<50%?) Here's me thinking there wouldn't be some wooly definition of freelance versus employed

It is less wooly than in the UK, but still not perfect.
You need to show you are a business and even the trivial things help. A business card, letterheaded paper etc. A web site (doesnt have to be fancy) are all plus pointers for you.

The one client issue can be a problem but if presented properly it does not have to be.
If you have had 1 client for 10 years then they will ask questions. If you have had 10 clients in 10 years they will accept this as multiple clients.
They do understand that for most contracts you will have to be full time on the clients site.

You will be better if you can get the client to produce a declared "work package" though you can still be freelance even if it is and "arbeitsuberlassung something" or AUG agreement.

I am in SW Germany. What Darmstadt says about registering is true, but not as heavily enforced as he suggests. I have had issues with deposits.

There are a few of us out here. Blaster in Frankfurt, Chef in Munich. Dont know where Darmie is right now and I am near Friedrichshafen. Chef has been to Stuttgart so one of us probably has some idea fo where you are looking for.

BTW its TLG not LGM

[whattodo]

Asking some questions on the accounting forum it sounds like being a freelancer isn't so clear cut...

If you work for the same Client co. all the time and use their hardware under their supervision, you'll have no basis to be FL. The only "Propper" way is to do Work Packages at your own "Office" with your own hardware.

That's what is was told by the local Finazamt Chief...

That could potentially make the take from a Client Co's contract pretty poor (<50%?) Here's me thinking there wouldn't be some wooly definition of freelance versus employed

[darmstadt]

Before you can rent anywhere you need to register at the einwohnermeldeamt as the landlord will want to see a load of paperwork. This will probably include a letter from your employer showing that your in work, proof of a bank account, etc. I would suggest searching the interweb as there are many sources of informaiton about moving to Germany, temporary or permanent. A lot of people find it a pain moving and living here and you'll a lot of moany old Brits but personally I found it hassle free and have had (practically) no problems in the 20 odd years I've been here. For more (sometimes very good) information and to read lots of whiney moany English speakers then try here

[whattodo]

Thanks guys [some of] the advice has been really useful

I've heard of some contracts in the south west of Germany, bit light on details as i'm only really thinking about it at the mo. Probably set up as self employed in that situation (having read the german tax thread).

It'd just be me and the missus going over there. The work i'm not so nervy about, it's getting ourselves set up somewhere new, and doing day to day things. I don't speak any German so it'd have to be a steep learning curve / classes for language. Or just do the english thing and talk louder

Renting a furnished flat sounds like the way to go, but it can be hard to get a decent place that isn't a rip off when you're busy and trying to fit flat hunting in around other things. Maybe the advice about staying in a hotel for a month wouldn't be a bad idea - Thanks for that and the links @ LGM

Getting a deposit back can be hard in the UK too, no matter what you do to the property. Sometimes i've wished I decorated the place in pot noodle... actually no... baby poo, with peanuts in it

Is it easy to set up the boring stuff like electricity, water, internet, a bank account? Do they have council tax? Other weird stuff I wouldn't have considered?

[darmstadt]

If you pay a deposit on an apartment, don't expect it back.

Maybe thats just you but I've always got my deposit back. By law the deposit money goes into a bank account which is opened just for that. No-one can touch it until you decide to vacate the apartment. When that time comes, the landlord then determines what he might have to pay to make good the apartment for the next tenant. If you've left it in the same nick as when you moved in then you should get all of it back plus the interest. I've always got the whole lot back and more. Maybe by decorating the walls with beer and wurst mixture then artexing the ceiling with pot noodle extract is not your landlords idea of an apartment in good condition...

[swamp]

Gibraltareans?

They don't count because they are British; they are us!

I've heard the Maltese have been fond of us ever since the 2nd Siege of Malta. And they show their gratitude each year by voting for us in the Eurovision, regardless of how tulipe we are, which is usually very tulipe indeed. The Maltese are also not very good in the Eurovision, but they are a small rock in the Mediterranean and not a big country which has produced great rock.

[Moscow Mule]

Read this

http://forums.contractoruk.com/accou...an-cometh.html

Understand the tax implications etc before you go...

[PRC1964]

Do the Germans not like us? Did we upset them? Is there anyone on the continent who likes us?

Gibraltareans?

[swamp]

I wouldn't bother. The market is dead as a dodo, the rates are crap, the lifestyle is really tulip, everything is really expensive, the Germans won't like you and its one less gig for me!

Do the Germans not like us? Did we upset them? Is there anyone on the continent who likes us?