Reply to: The Queen "might be racist"

[expat]

I suppose the dividing line here is whether you would be comfortable calling someone a '***' as this is where the term comes from. I wouldn't.

As has been stated, it all stems from less enlightened times.

The dividing line between what and what else?

Do you mean, the question of whether it is acceptable to any given individual to sell golliwog dolls is decided for that individual by his or her own attitude to calling someone a "***"?

Or that whether it is acceptable at all, is dependent on whether "people in general" wouldn't use the word?

Or do you mean that even owning or remembering golliwogs from childhood is unacceptable because some people are unhappy that the word "***" exists?

It may seem like pedantry but when one starts forbidding other people to do things, I think one is obliged to be clear about the reasons.

[Alf W]

I suppose the dividing line here is whether you would be comfortable calling someone a 'w o g' as this is where the term comes from. I wouldn't.

As has been stated, it all stems from less enlightened times.

[expat]

Yeah, we might not have any that weren't white, but we've certainly tried out a few different nationalities over the years, sometimes with great success.

As for gollies. It seems to me that we are simply instilling the belief in our children that it is actually illegal to cuddle coloured people.

Like Baa Baa Black Sheep? The song (believe it or not - check out the words) celebrates diversity, and praises the contribution made by a coloured minority.

So the people who want to ban it, are banning what?

[ratewhore]

I felt physically sick when someone sent me this article, I feel the Royal Family no longer represents the multicultural people of Great Britain

http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage...SS&ATTR=Royals

You're a sensitive soul aren't you? I'm surprised you've made it this far...

[Sysman]

FFS I had a gollywog when I was little and it was a great toy, I never saw it as a racist statement.

Those politically correct idiots should go **** themselves!!!

From the Sun:

Gollies began life in America in an 1899 story book by Florence Kate Upton.

They were popularised in Britain by Enid Blyton’s books — and a Golly was the logo on Robertsons Jam jars until scrapped in 2002.

As I kid I collected the labels from Robertsons Jam, and sent them off to get a series of Golly badges. Proper metal ones at that.

[Gonzo]

Definitely

I remember double-checking that word before posting it a couple of days ago too, I repeatedly make that same error.

I may be wrong about the IR35 police but this time....

Btw how's land of the long white cloud going?

OK so far - I am still in "having a long holiday" mode though. Note my comments in the "ethics" thread .

[dang65]

Queen racist? I say the whole damn lot of them are racist - just how many ethnic kings or queens have we had? Let me tell you - 0.

Yeah, we might not have any that weren't white, but we've certainly tried out a few different nationalities over the years, sometimes with great success.

As for gollies. It seems to me that we are simply instilling the belief in our children that it is actually illegal to cuddle coloured people.

And what are toys like Barbie or Krusty The Clown or Bob The Builder if they're not caricatures?

There was an interview this morning on the radio with the curator of the Museum of Childhood, and they asked her if black children were offended or shocked by the gollies they have on display and she basically said, "No not at all."

I doubt if anyone is really offended by these things. It's just that some individuals (of all races) like to stir things up. We should simply ignore them. There are already plenty of laws to deal with genuine racist issues.

Meanwhile, I'm glad we can just laugh at things like http://stuffwhitepeoplelike.com/ Mainly because it's funny.

#116 Black Music that Black People Don’t Listen to Anymore

All music genres go through a very similar life cycle: birth, growth, mainstream acceptance, decline, and finally obscurity. With black music, however, the final stage is never reached because white people work tirelessly to keep it alive. Apparently, once a music has lost its relevance with its intended audience, it becomes MORE relevant to white people.

etc

[oracleslave]

Definately a case where positive discrimination could be used to address the injustice by making certain that the next king or queen is from the ethnic minorities.

Definitely

I may be wrong about the IR35 police but this time....

Btw how's land of the long white cloud going?

[Gonzo]

A clear case of institutional racism if ever I saw one - we need to get Sir Ian Blair on the case right now.

Definately a case where positive discrimination could be used to address the injustice by making certain that the next king or queen is from the ethnic minorities.

[expat]

If your grandparents had slaves during your childhood or were openly racist towards others doesn't mean that you can keep slaves or be racist now, times change and things progress.

I personally dont think "golliwogs" should be on sale at Buckingham palace but I also dont think its fair to call someone a racist for things that happened in the past during a time when it was socially accepted to own/want/sell golliwogs.

Chef

Absolutely. They are not of now, they are of the past.

[ace00]

Queen racist? I say the whole damn lot of them are racist - just how many ethnic kings or queens have we had? Let me tell you - 0.

A clear case of institutional racism if ever I saw one - we need to get Sir Ian Blair on the case right now.

[chef]

To play devils advocate though, the golliwog's roots comes from stories which recount the "blackface minstrels" theatrical skits of north america.

These skits involved white people blackening their faces and mocking blacks as a form of theatre/comedy generally portraying blacks as stupid, lazy, 2nd class citizens. The popularity grew for this style of comedy and infiltrated popular story books of the time such as Enid Blyton books. This then led to "golliwog" toys becoming popular for children and somehow (never quite understood the reasoning behind it) became the logo for Robertsons jam.

So, although I agree it is part of our childhood, I myself have a "Chef" golliwog badge from collecting jam labels, I can also see the point that it's roots were very racist.

If your grandparents had slaves during your childhood or were openly racist towards others doesn't mean that you can keep slaves or be racist now, times change and things progress.

I personally dont think "golliwogs" should be on sale at Buckingham palace but I also dont think its fair to call someone a racist for things that happened in the past during a time when it was socially accepted to own/want/sell golliwogs.

Chef

[zara_backdog]

But in 2006 police seized three gollies from a shop in in Bromyard, Herefordshire, after complaints. They acted under Section 5 of the Public Order Act, which makes it an offence to display material which could be threatening, abusive or insulting.

I remember this - they sent three police cars to 'raid' the shop before it opened one morning

[expat]

Golliwogs were part of my upbringing and an integral part of my culture. I should be shocked if anyone were to attempt to negate my cultural heritage, and would definitely regard that as a racist action.

[GreenerGrass]

To be fair to the Queen I think the Duke of Edinburgh decides on the stock list for these shops.

I get physically sick every time somebody posts a link to the sun unless it's a page 3 stunna.

OK, just for you here is another story:
http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage...cle2204851.ece