Reply to: Spoke too soon ... agent on major piss take

[Archangel]

Actually, these are things that under the new rules they must ask for. They need proof that you are "entitled to work in the UK" under pain of a large fine. The fine is the same for them whether you work one day or one year (though the risk of getting found out is, of course, much less).

Personally, I don't see why you (or anybody else) should have an issue with supplying this - assuming that they will accept copies.

I agree, much of the other stuff is unnecessary.

tim

So when I have my PC fixed in PCworld I have to ask them for a copy of their passport?

Nonsense!

[xoggoth]

2 years? In defence maybe.

[mwoz03]

Thanks, Kate.

[Kate]

Sorry - part 2!

2. FINANCIAL RISK
i. The Supplier will negotiate the price for the Contract Works and is obliged to honour any agreed price.
ii. Defective work arising solely from services performed under this contract by the Supplier, its directors, employees, consultants, substitutes or hired assistance will be corrected by the Supplier at its own cost or in its own time.
iii. The Supplier warrants that it is qualified to perform the computer services and the Company shall not be liable for any act or omission on the part of the Supplier in respect of breach of this undertaking.
iv. The Supplier, its directors, employees or consultants will not be entitled to receive holiday pay or special absence pay in any circumstances.
v. The Supplier, its directors, employees or consultants will not be entitled to receive sick pay in any circumstances. The Supplier will bear the cost of any health insurance scheme which it may arrange at its own discretion.
vi. The Supplier will not be entitled to receive payment for cancelled Contract Works.
vii. The Supplier is not entitled to partake in any Company grievance procedure.
viii. The Supplier acknowledges the volatility of the (IT Industry) and accepts that there is the financial risk of bad debts when operating as an independent business on its own account.
ix. The Company is not obliged to offer ongoing contracts or Contract Works to the Supplier nor is the Supplier obliged to accept such contracts or Contract Works if offered. The Supplier is not obliged to make its services available. Specifically both parties accept that they do not wish to create or imply any mutuality of obligations whatsoever, either during the course of this Agreement or during any period when Contract Works are not available.
x. The Supplier accepts it has legal risk in respect of public liability and professional indemnity will therefore pay the costs of such insurance premiums.
xi. During the term of this Agreement and for the following six years the Supplier will maintain adequate insurance cover in respect of professional indemnity with cover up to at least £1,000,000.
xii. The Company reserves the right to offset any losses sustained as a result of the Supplier’s actions, breach or unsatisfactory performance, from the Supplier’s fees.
xiii. The Supplier will be responsible for bearing the costs of acquisition and maintenance of transport and the expenses of an accountant, business stationery and any other incidentals of being in business on its own account.
xiv. The Supplier is not entitled to receive any company benefits or partake in any pension run by the Company. Pension provision may be made by the Supplier at his own discretion for its directors or employees.

3. FREEDOM OF THE SUPPLIER TO UNDERTAKE OTHER WORKS
i. The Supplier is free to undertake other Contracts for Services for other parties at any time, either before, after, or concurrently with this Contract for Services.
ii. The Company acknowledges and agrees that it does not have first call on the services of the Supplier and cannot require the Supplier to give the Company any priority over another Company.
iii. The Supplier may advertise its services in any way it sees fit and the Company shall not raise any objection.
iv. The Supplier may use a business trading name.

4. CONFIDENTIALITY
i. The Supplier undertakes that it and its directors, employees, consultants and substitutes shall keep in the strictest confidence all details of trade secrets and secret information which may come into its possession during the completion of the Contract Works.
ii. At the end of the term of this Agreement the Supplier undertakes to deliver to the Company’s Client or as directed by the Company all documents relating to the Contract Works.
iii. All copyright and other intellectual property rights in all work, including all work of a preparatory or design nature, or developed or created from such work in performing the Contract Works for the Company shall be deemed to be the undisputed property of the Company’s Client.
iv. In the event of the Supplier being supplied with any material in which the Company’s Client owns the copyright or any other intellectual property rights the material will be supplied to the Supplier under a license which may be terminated on immediate notice, to use the same or any part thereof as the Company’s Client shall in its absolute discretion deem fit.
v. During the period of this contract and for a period of six months after the Contract Works have been completed the Supplier undertakes (on behalf of itself and any of its associated companies, partnerships and subsidiary companies) not to supply any services similar to the Contract Works to the Company’s Client.

5. TAXATION AND NATIONAL INSURANCE
i. The Supplier as an independent business is responsible for its own (corporation) tax.

6. BUSINESS ORGANISATION
i. The Supplier will prepare invoices for all Contract Works undertaken, on frequency confirmed in Schedule A.
ii. The Supplier, being a business on its own account will have its own business stationery and business cards and will, if requested by the Company supply a specimen for the Company’s records.
iii. The Supplier will at all times represent itself as an independent business and will in no circumstances represent itself or hold itself out as a servant or employee of the Company or the Client. The Supplier hereby acknowledges it is in business on its own account and is not part and parcel of the Company’s business.
iv. The Supplier will maintain at its own cost appropriate independent office accommodation.

7. TERMINATION

The Contract for Services can be immediately terminated by the Company for whatever reason, however the Supplier must give four weeks written notice of termination to the Company.

Without limitation, the Company may terminate this agreement with immediate effect giving the Supplier notice in writing if the Supplier or the Consultant are:
i. In breach of any of the terms of this agreement or any supplemental agreement dealing with confidentiality or intellectual property rights which, in any case of a breach capable of remedy, shall not have been remedied by the Supplier within 21 days of receipt by the Supplier of a notice from the Company specifying the breach and requiring its remedy.
ii. Incompetent and/or seriously or persistently negligent in carrying out the Services;
iii. Fail or refuse after written warning to carry out the Service whilst exercising all reasonable skill and care;
iv. In the case of the Client, be declared insolvent or makes a composition with its creditors or if a liquidator, receiver, administrator, administrative receiver or similar officer is appointed over any of its assets; or
v. Do or fail to do anything (whether or not connected with the performance of the Services) which, in the reasonable opinion of the Connections Director, adversely and seriously prejudices or it likely to so prejudice the Company’s interests of reputation.

8. INTENTION OF THE PARTIES
i. Both parties agree and intend that this legal relationship is one of providing independent specialist services and specifically is not a relationship of master and servant or employer and employee.
ii. The Parties to this Contract for Services specifically confirm that "the circumstances" referred to in S75 4A(1)(c) of the Welfare Reform and Pensions Act 1999 and any related taxation legislation, either current or to be introduced, refers solely to this Contract for Services and no other Agreement.
9. LEGAL ADVICE AND OTHER MATTERS
i. Both parties hereby acknowledge that they have had an opportunity to take independent legal advice before signing this Contract for Services.
ii. Both parties acknowledge that their contractual relationship is governed by this Contract for Services as a legally binding agreement.
iii. Both parties acknowledge that this Contract for Services is the whole agreement governing the contractual relationship between them.
iv. Words referring to the masculine are to include the feminine.
v. This Contract is governed by the laws of England and Wales.
vi. Breach of any clause or clauses in this Contract for Services will not void or annul this Contract for Services as a whole in any circumstances.
vii. In the event of any dispute arising from this Contract for Services an independent solicitor or accountant will be appointed to arbitrate in the first instance.
viii. The Parties agree and intend to be bound by this Contract for Services.

The Company

Signed:

Full Name of Signatory: XXXXXXXX

Dated: XXXXXXXX

The Supplier

Signed:

Full name of Signatory:

Dated:

SCHEDULE A

Section A The Supplier

Name: XXXXXXX

Address: XXXXXXXXX

Phone Number: XXXXXX

Company Registration Number: XXXXXXXXX

VAT Number: XXXXXX

Contact Name: XXXXXXXX

Section B Duration of Contract Works

Commencement Date: XXXXXXXX

End Date: XXXXXXXXX

Section C Contract Works Price

Nature of Contract Works to be undertaken: XXXXXXX.

Agreed Contract Works Price: XXXXXXXXX

Section D Invoicing Frequency

Monthly

The Company The Supplier

Signed:

Full Name of Signatory: XXXXXXXX

Dated: XXXXXXXX

[Kate]

IR35 compliant wording?

This looks compliant . Can be checked free by the Tax Office. But will Hays accept it??
This Contract for Services is made on the XXXXXXX.

BETWEEN

XXXXXXXX LIMITED whose Registered Office is situated at

XXXXXXXX

(known hereinafter as the Company) of the one part,

and XXXXXXXX

whose Registered Office is situated at

XXXXXXXXXX

(known hereinafter as the Supplier) of the other part.

DEFINITIONS

In this agreement the following terms shall, unless the context requires otherwise, have the following meanings:
i. the “Supplier” means XXXXXXX or any other person who performs the Services in his/her place under this agreement;
ii. the “Company” XXXXXXXX Ltd.
iii. The “Client” means the customer of the “Company” defined in the statement of work, or any third party they are introduced to for the provision of services through this client.
iv. The “Contract Works” means the works specified in Schedule A Section C of this agreement.
RECITALS

The Supplier is in business as a provider of specialist computer and information technology consultancy services and has skills and abilities and can undertake services that may be of use to the Company from time to time.

The Company and the Supplier agree and intend that when the Supplier agrees to undertake services to the Company it will do so in accordance with the Operative Provisions of this Contract for Services. This Agreement becomes binding on the Company only after the Company’s client has entered into a relevant and corresponding contract and all relevant purchase orders are in place (the Client Contract), with the Client.

OPERATIVE PROVISIONS
1. THE CONTRACT WORKS TO BE UNDERTAKEN, CONTRACT WORKS PRICE, SUBSTITUTION AND ASSOCIATED MATTERS
i. This Contract for Services shall commence on date stated in Schedule A attached and thereafter will terminate in accordance with the dates entered in Schedule A attached.
ii. Within 7 days of the signing of this Agreement, the Supplier will supply the Company with a copy of the relevant certificate of Incorporation and VAT registration (if applicable) together with relevant bank details. The Company is not liable for the payment of any fees until 4 working days after the receipt of these documents or the date on which both the Company and the Supplier have entered into the Client Contract, whichever is the later date.
iii. The Original Term of the Agreement is as set out in Schedule A, and new contracts for services may be negotiated by agreement in writing between the parties.
iv. The Supplier agrees to undertake (the Services) to the Company ("The Contract Works"). The Supplier undertakes to fulfil its contractual obligations with all reasonable skill care and diligence.
v. The Supplier agrees to undertake the Services in a professional manner at all times and will undertake the Services in the capacity of a specialist.
vi. The Company shall not control how the Supplier is to perform the Contract Works. The Company recognises that the Supplier offers specialist services at a high level of expertise and as such the Supplier cannot be told how to perform the Contract Works.
vii. The Supplier undertakes that it will devote all reasonable time, attention, skill and ability as the Contract Works require.
viii. The Supplier will use its own initiative in how the Contract Works are to be completed and will have reasonable flexibility as to the performance of the Contract Works but will nonetheless assist the Company by making all reasonable attempts to work within an overall agreed deadline, will observe Health and Safety regulations and will comply with all reasonable operational requirements relating to working hours and security.
ix. Start and finish times are at the reasonable discretion of the Supplier within an overall programme of Contract Works which will be verbally agreed from time to time.
x. The Supplier may, at its reasonable discretion, send a substitute or delegate to perform the Contract Works provided that the person has sufficient skill knowledge and ability to perform the Contract Works. This right to send a substitute or delegate is unlimited provided that the Supplier is acting reasonably, the agreement of the Company is not required although the Supplier must give the Company four weeks notice in writing of this intention.
xi. Where a substitute or delegate is sent by the Supplier, the Company shall have no contractual, financial or legal relationship with the substitute or delegate. The Supplier is solely responsible for arranging payments to the substitute or delegate and the substitute or delegate is answerable only to the Supplier.
xii. The whole or part of this Contract for Services may be assigned or subcontracted to any third party at the reasonable discretion of the Supplier and agreement by the Company.
xiii. Whilst the Supplier is initially represented by XXXXXXXXX the Supplier may, at its reasonable discretion, utilise directors, employees or self employed persons in order to complete the Contract Works and may also utilise the services of employees or self employed persons in an administration capacity. Such persons will be answerable solely to the Supplier and the Company shall have no contractual, financial or legal relationship with the hired assistance. Payments to the above persons will be the sole responsibility of the Supplier.
xiv. The Contract Price for the Contract Works will be negotiated and agreed as between the Company and the Supplier from time to time and this will be detailed in Schedule A attached.
xv. The Company will pay the Supplier’s Contract Price (plus VAT) in accordance with the rates set out in Schedule A against the presentation of an invoice and timesheets signed by a representative of the Company’s Client.
xvi. The Company can require the Supplier to undertake the Contract Works at a different site or location from that verbally agreed at the outset of this Contract for Services with the Supplier’s consent. Such consent will not to be unreasonably withheld, but the Supplier reserves the right to verbally re-negotiate the price for the Contract Works.
xvii. Both the Company and the Supplier agree that this is a Contract for Services essentially in respect of specialist services only.
xviii. The Supplier can benefit from its own sound management of the execution of the Contract Works by negotiating effectively and using hired assistance or substitutes at its own discretion.

[mwoz03]

Hi Kate,

If you don't mind me asking is it ir35 complaint?

[Kate]

Limited Company Contractor (HSR20)

The Hays website says-
If you intend offering your services via a limited company:

You must have in your possession a countersigned Terms of Assignment of Consultants via a Limited Company Contractor (HSR20)

I`m looking for a copy. If it makes the contracting company an "employee" is there any benefit in taking a contract as a company?

[Mailman]

Actually, these are things that under the new rules they must ask for. They need proof that you are "entitled to work in the UK" under pain of a large fine.

THis requirement has always been there, for you to prove you are who you say you are and that you are entitled to work here if you are a foreign national.

My last agents tried it on when I signed the extension, they were demanding all sorts of information...which I had already given them prior to starting the original contract! Although having said that they werent too bad, paid weekly too!

Mailman

[MarillionFan]

"What do you expect ? They're a temping agency and your contract was probably the same as the Tesco checkout lady got."

He'd be so lucky!

[oraclesmith]

What do you expect ? They're a temping agency and your contract was probably the same as the Tesco checkout lady got.

[Sockpuppet]

Write them a letter from the managing director of your Ltd company stating that your company has checked and verified all your personal details and that your company warrants these to be correct. State that your company will indemnify the agent should any of this turn out to be false.

You'd like to think so wouldn't you.

I've offically told them I'm not taking it. For 5 days pay when I have other work I could be doing I didn't see the point.

My reasons for not handing over NI/Passport details is that I am a business. Do they ask for the NI details of the tesco checkout lady when they are shopping? They were adament that they needed originals and that a letter wouldnt do. I am after all a busines, if they can't deal with this then fine. I am keen to get away from as much of this "new" legislation as possible - you dont see DHL supplying NI details to customers do you.

I offered to opt out of eb regs (knowing that I am already introduced to the client so that would make no difference).

The contract also had a few gems in there:

"Co-operate with the clients staff and accept the direct supervision and instruction of any responsible person in the Clients organisation;"

I think that just says IR35. Yeah its about working practices but the contract was so one sided that there was no way that I was signing it.

I didnt want to seem like I was being akward, for the right agents I am a nice candidate. The agents that have placed me even get told when I know there are jobs going so they can get a person in there. Helps them and they give me first refusal on most stuff. But when the agent seems to be intent on getting you in there on his/her terms and to **** with what you want then I take exception.

[The Lone Gunman]

Write them a letter from the managing director of your Ltd company stating that your company has checked and verified all your personal details and that your company warrants these to be correct. State that your company will indemnify the agent should any of this turn out to be false.


That should do it every time.

[crack_ho]

The Contract I assume is the HPPS20 contract not HRS as in your post.
There are few variations of this contract but mainly it does not pass IR35.

[shoes]

I think this kind of information is only required by law if you have not opted out of the agency regulations. I think a lot of agents are handling this requirement by just giving a script to their idiot phone monkeys with a list of things to ask for, the person you speak to probably isn't aware of where this requirement comes from or whether or not it actually applies to a particular contractor.

If you can afford to just ditch the gig. The larger 'streamlined' agencies are appalling for this kind of crap. Perhaps you should just call the client to see if you can go direct. Make sure they know why it has become direct or nothing. If you don't the agency will make up something to put you in bad light instead.

[tim123]

I've already given them three. THey are adament its "the law" that they must cover a 2 year period. They later admitted that they were making this up but it was "internal policy" to get 2 years in case anything goes wrong. Its 5 days work ffs!

Told them to take it or leave it. They certainly are not getting NI details / passport..

Actually, these are things that under the new rules they must ask for. They need proof that you are "entitled to work in the UK" under pain of a large fine. The fine is the same for them whether you work one day or one year (though the risk of getting found out is, of course, much less).

Personally, I don't see why you (or anybody else) should have an issue with supplying this - assuming that they will accept copies.

I agree, much of the other stuff is unnecessary.

tim