Reply to: Time to abolish the NHS

[sasguru]

At least it is being debated on this site (I use the word "debate" loosely ) whereas politicians dare not challenge what is in reality a monument of socialism and a totem of guilt.

Aye the NHS has become a sacred cow. It would be political suicide to tamper with it other than sink more money into it. It shows how unthinking the general populace have become - they hold on to the idea even when it is clear it is probably the worst health service in the Western world.

[DodgyAgent]

At least it is being debated on this site (I use the word "debate" loosely ) whereas politicians dare not challenge what is in reality a monument of socialism and a totem of guilt.

[rootsnall]

I sincerely hope you've tucked your trackies inside your white sports socks, otherwise you're nothing but a faker.

Nope, tucked in but wearing five for a quid Asda black socks. It's much better as you are shunned by all social groups.

[chicane]

Currently wearing kickers and trackies myself.

I sincerely hope you've tucked your trackies inside your white sports socks, otherwise you're nothing but a faker.

[rootsnall]

My healthcare is funded by the NHS, and my local doctors surgery is still full of winos and smackheads, generally clad in Rockports and trackies. Oh, and I have to pay for medicine.

Currently wearing kickers and trackies myself.

[chicane]

I once had the pleasure of getting sick in the States, no insurance and was skint. I eventually found a free clinic and queued with various winos and smackheads and a nice young english Dr gave me some free medicine and sorted me out. I was very pleased with the level of care.

My healthcare is funded by the NHS, and my local doctors surgery is still full of winos and smackheads, generally clad in Rockports and trackies. Oh, and I have to pay for medicine.

[wendigo100]

The evidence shows that the Tax Credit system is working very well for the vast majority of hard-working families. There are some cases where overpayments have been made, however this is the fault of the recipients, who provided incorrect information to be used in assessing their award. I would draw your attention to the fact that, if these people had provided similarly incorrect information to HM Revenue and Customs, they would not only be facing a demand for the money back, but would also be facing large fines, and possibly imprisonment, for evasion of taxes.

Regarding the National Health Service, evidence again shows that the improvements that I have funded over the past few years have resulted in record levels of public satisfaction. There are now more doctors and nurses than ever before, shorter waiting lists than ever before, and patients are enjoying faster recovery rates than ever before.

Thank you Gordon, for the view from the bunker.

[rootsnall]

If 'solved' means that the poor (and I'm not just talking about the very poor / unemployed etc.) are screwed when it comes to healthcare, then the US is your model. There is also a self-interest argument which is that very few people can guarantee their own future economic position and healthcare needs. The US is full of cases of people developing complex and expensive health problems which also lead them unable to work. Insurers are pretty good at withdrawing cover for these people who represent a significant cost. Healthcare bills are now a leading cause of personal bankruptcy in the US. I think I'll take my chances in the NHS or one of the better continental European systems.

I once had the pleasure of getting sick in the States, no insurance and was skint. I eventually found a free clinic and queued with various winos and smackheads and a nice young english Dr gave me some free medicine and sorted me out. I was very pleased with the level of care.

[The Farmer]

Well said Gordon, its refreshing to read some sense from a politician these days.

Well constructed and solid arguments - good luck in your new job, no doubt you are as pleased as me to see the back of the Showman Blair.

Got any poems????

[AlfredJPruffock]

The evidence shows that the Tax Credit system is working very well for the vast majority of hard-working families. There are some cases where overpayments have been made, however this is the fault of the recipients, who provided incorrect information to be used in assessing their award. I would draw your attention to the fact that, if these people had provided similarly incorrect information to HM Revenue and Customs, they would not only be facing a demand for the money back, but would also be facing large fines, and possibly imprisonment, for evasion of taxes.

Regarding the National Health Service, evidence again shows that the improvements that I have funded over the past few years have resulted in record levels of public satisfaction. There are now more doctors and nurses than ever before, shorter waiting lists than ever before, and patients are enjoying faster recovery rates than ever before.

Well said Gordon, its refreshing to read some sense from a politician these days.

Well constructed and solid arguments - good luck in your new job, no doubt you are as pleased as me to see the back of the Showman Blair.

[Zorba]

The UK is the ONLY developed country where the Health Service is centrally funded. You'd have thought that would give cause to explore other options?

I think I agree, if I've understood correctly. In this country, there is free healthcare of a certain standard for all. However, many people spend lots of money to access a higher level of healthcare at BUPA etc. My problem is that they are often competing for the same resources as the NHS patients.

A fairer system would be to lower the free healthcare level and to charge medical insurance for all for the higher cost items, payable to the NHS - since it would be spread across the population, it would reduce costs from the ridiculous private healthcare costs that exist now, plus it would prevent money being siphoned off into the private sector healthcare providers and it would also avoid having two separate queues for the same care givers. An example: my wife is being treated for a condition at the moment. It has been under private health insurance up to the annual limit of our cover. The moment the consultant noticed that the insurance would no longer cover the treatment, he offered to sign her up for his NHS clinic at a nearby hospital. This would be for four-to-six-weekly treatments as opposed to fortnightly treatments, but with the same guy. Crazy!

[sasguru]

The UK is the ONLY developed country where the Health Service is centrally funded. You'd have thought that would give cause to explore other options?

[Old Greg]

Yes.

If 'solved' means that the poor (and I'm not just talking about the very poor / unemployed etc.) are screwed when it comes to healthcare, then the US is your model. There is also a self-interest argument which is that very few people can guarantee their own future economic position and healthcare needs. The US is full of cases of people developing complex and expensive health problems which also lead them unable to work. Insurers are pretty good at withdrawing cover for these people who represent a significant cost. Healthcare bills are now a leading cause of personal bankruptcy in the US. I think I'll take my chances in the NHS or one of the better continental European systems.

[Zorba]

brilliant idea. can they do our trains too?!

Why not? Realistically speaking, if we're prepared to outsource the management of the countries servers etc to India why not outsource the management of key functions such as health and public transport to a country that is arguably closer in terms of economics and social rules? There wouldn't be any issues of people being paid a pittance for the service so no social guilt, plus the nurses and doctors etc would still be in full employment. Note that it's the management and not the execution I'm talking about here - Gauloise-chain-smoking conductors on the London-Manchester express would probably not be welcome, although I'd consider a French nurse...

[malvolio]

You may recall there was a big research project run on NHS funding about 6 years ago. Gay Gordon set the Ts&Cs so there was only one possible answer - the mess we have now - and specifically excluded looking at, much less proposing, the French /German /Spanish /You-name-it ones that actually work.

He's not interested in the NHS, he's interested in centralised power. Do not expect anything to improve when (sorry, now) he's PM