Reply to: Umbrella Companies

[LJames75]

I start my commuting by public transport at 04:30 in the morning, and arrive at the clients site at 08:00.

I leave the clients site at 16:30 and return home via public transport at 19:00hrs, sometimes later.

I claim for my daily bus and train fares, as the route I travel does not qualify for a season ticket. And I am on the buses & trains before 09:05 therefore along with everybody else, subjected to high cost in fares.

Yep penalised for going to work....

And I claim for my baguette meal deals. And that is all I can claim for as outlined by the IR guide.

Some other "umbrella companies" have said that I can claim extra for being out of the house for 12 hours, this being allowed to claim £21 a day in subsistence as well as a few extra bit and bobs.

[malvolio]

Obviously I must have been mis-informed then back in March/April 07 by the Inland Revenue.

And the booklet they sent out to me is total lies.

As when Mantor sent out the email, they gave us all a contact number for the IR help line.

And I put across several scenarios to the IR, as I called them 3 times to recheck with them. And they calculated everything for me there and then.

They told me what I could claim and could not claim in terms of travel expenses under umbrella.

Are you travelling to client's site once a week and staying away from home for four nights. If so you can legitimately claim £5 a night sundry expenses and hotel bills at cost and your evening meal. That's it. Not much scope for profit, is there.

Or if you are travelling daily , you can claim mileage at 40p a mile (for a while) or rail fares at cost. That stops once you know you are going to be there more than 24 months. Plus, of course, you can't claim subsistence since you aren't working away from home unless you're working more than 14 hour days.

Them's the rules which are the ones in the HMRC's guides Because if you're claiming more than that, (a) you're one of the reasons we get punitive tax rules for small businesses and (b) you're commiting tax evasion, not avoidance.

Get it?

[pisces]

I had an email from Orangegenie yesterday highlighting the two recent IR35 wins for HMRC, they were trying to scare me into using them again by suggesting my Ltd wasn’t safe any more!

I think a retaliation letter bomb is in order

[LJames75]

Obviously I must have been mis-informed then back in March/April 07 by the Inland Revenue.

And the booklet they sent out to me is total lies.

As when Mantor sent out the email, they gave us all a contact number for the IR help line.

And I put across several scenarios to the IR, as I called them 3 times to recheck with them. And they calculated everything for me there and then.

They told me what I could claim and could not claim in terms of travel expenses under umbrella.

[malvolio]

I am somewhat bemused with DaveP's post.

I am with Mantor.co.uk and I have never had a problem.

Nuff said. You don't know the rules on expenses and £20 a week is more than I pay for MyCo's accountant, who a lot of people say is too expensive anyway.

You do have a problem, you just don't know what it is...

[LisaContractorUmbrella]

They do pay dividends, but in order to do this they make me a director a
a ltd company which is justa ltd company within there organisation (non profit making etc)

so thats how they get round that.

Any recommendations ?

Dave

Hi DaveP

The MSC legislation basically states that you cannot receive dividends through a third party company, only through your own limited company over which you must have financial and adminstrative control. If you do not have a company bank account, don't determine your own salary etc etc you are using a scheme that is unlawful.

HTH

[gingerjedi]

I had an email from Orangegenie yesterday highlighting the two recent IR35 wins for HMRC, they were trying to scare me into using them again by suggesting my Ltd wasn’t safe any more!

[ASB]

I am still claiming my allocated expenses from Home to Work and I am still claiming the allocated daily subsistance. And that is it.

.........

I know that I can sleep at night and not have the taxman knocking on my door, as I know that Mantor and myself are working within the IR guidelines.

Regards
Lee

These two statements are of course mutually exclusive.

You should research the following:-

Of ****. Can't be bothered yet again.

[LJames75]

I am somewhat bemused with DaveP's post.

I am with Mantor.co.uk and I have never had a problem.

Until March 31st 2007 they ran Umbrella and Composite companies.

Then with the IR changes. Mantor.co.uk sent out an email with a choice as well as pro's and cons in terms of it's clients going Limited or Umbrella company.

When I was under the composite company "Mantor Consultants", I was paid in dividends.

Therefore I worked my hours, I claimed my expenses being Mileage or other travel costs to and from home, and I also claimed the allocated subsistence rate per day.

And when required I claimed back on the odd IT item, such as a USB memory Stick or DVD's. Therefore I got my weekly wage based on the above.

Now with the changes and the wonderful grey area of IR35, I moved under the Umbrella of Mantor Ltd.

I am still claiming my allocated expenses from Home to Work and I am still claiming the allocated daily subsistance. And that is it.

I pay PAYE and NI, along with my other deductions. And I am still happy with my take home pay. Ok I could go as my own limited company, but I only have short term contracts. I pay £20 a week for Mantor to process my timesheets and expenses, and all the other paperwork that is required.

And I get paid weekly. I have been with Mantor for over 4 years now, I have never had a late payment, never had a missing timesheet, and everytime I get a new contract. I simply email Mantor to say who I will be working for how much the hourly rate is, and then pass on the contact details of the agency I am with. Then I also pass on Mantor's details to the agency so copy of my contact is sent over.

And hey presto I start work and fax through my timesheet and expenses form every friday. I know that I can sleep at night and not have the taxman knocking on my door, as I know that Mantor and myself are working within the IR guidelines.

Regards
Lee

[tim123]

They do pay dividends, but in order to do this they make me a director a
a ltd company which is justa ltd company within there organisation (non profit making etc)

so thats how they get round that.

No, it's how they "do it". They are not getting around anything because currently there is nothing to "get around".

But when (in April) there is a rule to "get around", this will not do it.

If that makes sense.

tim

[malvolio]

It seems like a MSP to me. The type of organisation Gordo is trying to shut down.

Well not really. You can still use them, but you'll pay full PAYE and NICs, not be able to claim expenses and not be able to take dividends. Not really such a good idea any more (not that it ever was IMHO!)

[realityhack]

They do pay dividends, but in order to do this they make me a director a
a ltd company which is justa ltd company within there organisation (non profit making etc)

so thats how they get round that.

Any recommendations ?

Dave

Do a search on IR35 and pre-budget report. Get out of that co. now. See the sticky thread in accounting.

[DaveP]

They do pay dividends, but in order to do this they make me a director a
a ltd company which is justa ltd company within there organisation (non profit making etc)

so thats how they get round that.

Any recommendations ?

Dave

[kramer]

here endeth the lesson!

[malvolio]

If they pay dividends, they are not an umbrella, or they are doing so illegally. Looking at the website they are an MSC, and are most likely in deep doo-doo after April 5th (actually, they aren't but you will be).

Either go to a proper umbrella, or get your own company.