NATO - you can't have your cake and eat it.

[PurpleGorilla]

You also need to examine what is actual in the spend, as AFAIK the US include their Veterans costs (which is greater than our actual MOD spend), so you could argue that lots of the USA expense is actually included in general budgets elsewhere - plus they've vast expenses in (hidden-ish) procurement where it's actually for other reasons.

USA Veterans $78.4bn
UK MOD £35bn

Lol the USA is dripping in tech and capability, aircraft carriers, stealth bombers, cruise missiles, ICBMs, VTOL. It's self evident their spending is legit.

[shaunbhoy]

You also need to examine what is actual in the spend, as AFAIK the US include their Veterans costs (which is greater than our actual MOD spend), so you could argue that lots of the USA expense is actually included in general budgets elsewhere - plus they've vast expenses in (hidden-ish) procurement where it's actually for other reasons.

USA Veterans $78.4bn
UK MOD £35bn

What a load of bollox. If, like the French and Germans, you never put your head above the parapet, then you never GET any veterans.
Yet despite this their contributions are feeble in the extreme.

I don't blame the Yanks in the least for questioning some countries' commitment.

[b r]

You also need to examine what is actual in the spend, as AFAIK the US include their Veterans costs (which is greater than our actual MOD spend), so you could argue that lots of the USA expense is actually included in general budgets elsewhere - plus they've vast expenses in (hidden-ish) procurement where it's actually for other reasons.

USA Veterans $78.4bn
UK MOD £35bn

[greenlake]

NATO - you can't have your cake and eat it.

Sure you can....

[PurpleGorilla]

Brexit

We are leaving

[darmstadt]

We are stronger together but if you want to be in the club you need to meet your obligations.

Brexit

[BrilloPad]

CUK gets worse mods

After you it could only get better.

[PurpleGorilla]

Who needs NATO anymore? Maybe the, nearly 2% of GDP, that the UK put in could be diverted to the NHS Actually with the rise of the populist right wing which is in turn in thrall and funded by the Putin regime maybe it will be disbanded once your idols of Wilders, Le Pen, Farage, et. al. get into power

We are stronger together but if you want to be in the club you need to meet your obligations.

[MarillionFan]

Well this is going to play into Brussels and Russia's hands.

The EU wanted an EU army.
US won't pay for NATO unless others do
UK Brexits
EU states they don't need the U.S. and so will setup an EU army
Germany pays and says it needs to rearm properly and needs nukes to be on equal footing
U.S. pulls out of NATO
Russia starts to test the waters
US is back in isolation or worst Trump is a Russian Stooge
Russia and Germany nuke each other
Russia being large nukes everyone
US does nothing
Putin becomes President of US as Trump is really his brother
CUK gets worse mods

You heard it here first

[darmstadt]

Anyone with a land border with Russia?

OK, not China ( well not directly anyway)

So not the USA then?

[RSoles]

Who needs NATO anymore?

Anyone with a land border with Russia?

OK, not China ( well not directly anyway)

[darmstadt]

Who needs NATO anymore? Maybe the, nearly 2% of GDP, that the UK put in could be diverted to the NHS Actually with the rise of the populist right wing which is in turn in thrall and funded by the Putin regime maybe it will be disbanded once your idols of Wilders, Le Pen, Farage, et. al. get into power

[BrilloPad]

Germany should be spending at least 10% of GDP on "defence". Or Der Attack as they say in the farterland.

[NotAllThere]

Moved to General - watch where you're posting PurpleGorilla!

[PurpleGorilla]

Protection comes with obligations. No cherry picking...

"The US vice-president has delivered the most uncompromising message yet from the Trump administration to Nato allies that they have to step up financial contributions towards defence spending.

On his first visit to Europe since taking office, Mike Pence said “some of our largest allies do not have a credible path” towards paying their share of Nato’s financial burden. Although he did not name individual countries, his targets included Germany, France and Italy. “The time has come to do more,” he said."

https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...e_iOSApp_Other



Belgium and Luxemberg again, founding EU members getting more than they put in. Easy to be wealthy when you get others to pay for everything.