Reply to: In or Out of the EU

[TestMangler]

They won't be known this time round either.

Any claims that we're sleepwalking into a European superstate ( which its patently obvious we are) will be met with howls of dersion from the establishment mouthpieces.

Absolutely. There were people last time suggesting some of the things that happened before might be on the cards and they were generally laughed at.

[Gumbo Robot]

Not disagreeing that it will be a resounding 'yes' this time round. What I was saying was that had the full facts and plans been known first time round, it would have been a 'no'.

Remember this was only 30ish years after the end of WWII and it was sold as 'breaking down trade barriers between European countries'.

I only remember it because there was a football match to commemorate it, The 6 v The 3.

They won't be known this time round either.

Any claims that we're sleepwalking into a European superstate ( which its patently obvious we are) will be met with howls of dersion from the establishment mouthpieces.

[TestMangler]

It will be a resounding Yes, make no mistake about it... ok, perhaps not resounding but yes nonetheless.

I haven't seen any recent opinion polls on this recently but I'd imagine that the No camp would have the advantage at the moment and will probably continue to do so until the last minute when various captains of industry will be wheeled out to to put the frighteners on the gullible voting public vis á vis job security, pensions etc. pretty much the same as they did with the Scots referendum.

And they will be given a much bigger platform on which to do it than will anyone dissenting from this view.

Not disagreeing that it will be a resounding 'yes' this time round. What I was saying was that had the full facts and plans been known first time round, it would have been a 'no'.

Remember this was only 30ish years after the end of WWII and it was sold as 'breaking down trade barriers between European countries'.

I only remember it because there was a football match to commemorate it, The 6 v The 3.

[Gumbo Robot]

Hate to agree with the Prawn but this is exactly right. We increased 'common market' membership to nine countries at that point. If anyone had seen what was to come, I think it would have been a resounding 'no'.

It will be a resounding Yes, make no mistake about it... ok, perhaps not resounding but yes nonetheless.

I haven't seen any recent opinion polls on this recently but I'd imagine that the No camp would have the advantage at the moment and will probably continue to do so until the last minute when various captains of industry will be wheeled out to to put the frighteners on the gullible voting public vis á vis job security, pensions etc. pretty much the same as they did with the Scots referendum.

And they will be given a much bigger platform on which to do it than will anyone dissenting from this view.

[TestMangler]

It was a "common market" meant to ease free trade, that was it. Nothing more.

Now it's an all encompassing EU superstate with our legal right to control most aspects of our lives dictated without any democratic basis.

No one voted for this.

Hate to agree with the Prawn but this is exactly right. We increased 'common market' membership to nine countries at that point. If anyone had seen what was to come, I think it would have been a resounding 'no'.

[Gumbo Robot]

Agreed on all points. Cloud cuckoo land of course due to the piggies at the trough element, but you never know in an alternate reality it might happen.

I've seen it in action and it's a very nice trough to get your snout into.

As an EU functionary, even if you were just a regular PM, you'd have your own office, secretary, private education for your kids and you'd get your lunch wheeled in on a trolley every day.

Most of us IT bods who were drafted in via 3rd party suppliers never lived this high life though.

[TykeMerc]

I could support the EU if...

• It was accountable
• It was auditable
• If it was not so expensive to remain a member and there were not so many piggies at the trough
• If it did not waste money on stupid projects that benefit very few
• If it did not participate in fraud to allow states that would otherwise be disqualified from membership to join
• If it treated all members equally when it comes to sanctions for non compliance
• If it was ONLY for a common market
• If it didn't poke its socialist nose into everything

Agreed on all points. Cloud cuckoo land of course due to the piggies at the trough element, but you never know in an alternate reality it might happen.

[SueEllen]

I could support the EU if...

• It was accountable
• It was auditable
• If it was not so expensive to remain a member and there were not so many piggies at the trough
• If it did not waste money on stupid projects that benefit very few
• If it did not participate in fraud to allow states that would otherwise be disqualified from membership to join
• If it treated all members equally when it comes to sanctions for non compliance
• If it was ONLY for a common market
• If it didn't poke its socialist nose into everything

It is a little puzzling that the overwhelming lean to the Tories in the GE by posters here is not matched by their view on the EU

Not all Tories are against the EU be they party members or elected politicians.

Likewise not all Labour party members and elected politicians want to be in the EU.

In fact the only parties who consistently want to be part of the EU are the smaller parties such as the Greens and what is left of the Lib Dems.

Be aware by elected politicians I mean anyone from councillors to MPs to MEPs. Lots of MPs were councillors before they got their seats.......

[tractor]

...

I could support the EU if...

• It was accountable
• It was auditable
• If it was not so expensive to remain a member and there were not so many piggies at the trough
• If it did not waste money on stupid projects that benefit very few
• If it did not participate in fraud to allow states that would otherwise be disqualified from membership to join
• If it treated all members equally when it comes to sanctions for non compliance
• If it was ONLY for a common market
• If it didn't poke its socialist nose into everything

It is a little puzzling that the overwhelming lean to the Tories in the GE by posters here is not matched by their view on the EU

[xoggoth]

It was a "common market" meant to ease free trade, that was it. Nothing more.

Being ancient I can confirm you are quite right, that was exactly how it was presented at the time. Mind you, some "conspiracy theorists" were warning us about the truth that that utter bastard Heath was concealing. Just shows it makes more sense to believe "loonies" than politicians.

[DimPrawn]

And those that voted did not vote for the EU we have now.

It was a "common market" meant to ease free trade, that was it. Nothing more.

Now it's an all encompassing EU superstate with our legal right to control most aspects of our lives dictated without any democratic basis.

No one voted for this.

[Roger Mellie]

I wonder if the EU referendum question will be anything like the UKIP one for a change in the voting system: Yes or undecided

I think the question will be "do you want your own country operated on the perverted theories of Karl Marx or by the sane principles of the BRITISH peoples who once upon a time administrated 2/3s of the globe". After all, my grand parents fought for the sovereignly of my country and not for my country to be dictated to by the ideological descendants of National Socialism. If you want to know where the Nazis got their ideas from then just read up on your Karl Marx.

HTH

[Flashman]

Something closer to "should the UK become a third world country?"

So a promotion then?

[darmstadt]

I wonder if the EU referendum question will be anything like the UKIP one for a change in the voting system: Yes or undecided

[MicrosoftBob]

Something closer to "should the UK become a third world country like Wales?"

FTFY