Reply to: Recent experiences @ Deutsche bank?

[cloudy]

I love it - Paying people 600 a day is cutting to the bone

Try cutting it to 60 a day and see how it means to be to the bone

They've cut through that now.

[clearedforlanding]

Don't think I've worked anywhere where there is a single sweeping culture across the organisation, always differed from the various business units/physical offices. Big banks in particular, where typically I've seen Investment business units work every given hour and nobody flinched until 7pm yet in the same bank within Retail there's puffs of smoke at 5pm.

Now I may or may not have experience of working in said bank in OPs title but I would say this bank is a little more aggressive than most...

Kinda describes the City's drug habits in a nutshell.

[MSC7]

Don't think I've worked anywhere where there is a single sweeping culture across the organisation, always differed from the various business units/physical offices. Big banks in particular, where typically I've seen Investment business units work every given hour and nobody flinched until 7pm yet in the same bank within Retail there's puffs of smoke at 5pm.

Now I may or may not have experience of working in said bank in OPs title but I would say this bank is a little more aggressive than most...

[cloudy]

It is in the context of it creating a brain drain as good people leave for better paying roles and others get cut whether they like it or not.

It's not just DB doing this. A plague on all their houses..

[Crossroads]

I love it - Paying people 600 a day is cutting to the bone

Try cutting it to 60 a day and see how it means to be to the bone

It is in the context of it creating a brain drain as good people leave for better paying roles and others get cut whether they like it or not.

[LondonPM1]

Deutsche Bank sacks British boss John Cryan after years of losses - BBC News
New CEO will mean some potential new opportunity in IT for contractors once the new management team understand a little about the situation here. Give it 2-3 months I think you will see a few decent paying roles as one of the previous problems was the massive IT cuts meant no way to save money & move forward as the previous now axed himself CEO thought losing thousands of staff was the answer! They need to modernise which cost lots of money especially as their IT budgets have been cut to the bone for years that means they will sooner or later have to pay the going rate!!

I love it - Paying people 600 a day is cutting to the bone

Try cutting it to 60 a day and see how it means to be to the bone

[uk contractor]

Deutsche Bank sacks British boss John Cryan after years of losses - BBC News
New CEO will mean some potential new opportunity in IT for contractors once the new management team understand a little about the situation here. Give it 2-3 months I think you will see a few decent paying roles as one of the previous problems was the massive IT cuts meant no way to save money & move forward as the previous now axed himself CEO thought losing thousands of staff was the answer! They need to modernise which cost lots of money especially as their IT budgets have been cut to the bone for years that means they will sooner or later have to pay the going rate!!

[MrButton]

Given that contractors are twice the price of a perm why would you hire a contractor?!

This is basically not true. There are many reasons but you can’t compare solely the take home.

Hiring permies means many more overheads and responsibility.

Yes they may not be obliged to pay redundancy but there is still a hell of a lot of hoops they need to jump through to get rid of someone still with a risk of being sued.

All of this costs money, a lot of money. So it’s not as black and white as you think.

[LondonPM1]

I suspect it is more because they fire permies rather than because they hire contractors. The extremely frequent headcount reduction cycle leads to permies being binned off with massive redundancy payouts, and canned projects. Fast forwards six months, canned projects are restarted from scratch and a new hiring cycle begins to replace the people they binned at massive expense. I knew Barclays permies receiving a six figure payout despite being a couple of years from retirement.

Oh, the outsourcing-insourcing-outsourcing-insourcing cycle will be the other reason.

What you are saying is the amount of attrition is negative to a project? If yes I buy that but doesnt contractors by its nature mean more variance in the number of people working on a project?

[LondonPM1]

Well. If you knew you needed them for 9 months then you would hire contractors.

If you knew you needed someone for the foreseeable then you’d hire permanent.

Is this a trick question or are you just a little slow?

I m obviously a bit slow so go easy with me

We already established in previous posts that perm is no safer then contractor for the first two years and perm can be marched off just as easily.

Given that contractors are twice the price of a perm why would you hire a contractor?!

[LondonPM1]

So I've accepted a contract at DB, through an agency - due to start at the end of the month - the money is good, but didn't do my DD and now am wondering whether its a good idea..

Has anyone worked their recently?

Congrats - Its a good bank with a lot to work on - Just fit in and you ll be fine

I m waiting patiently for the long timers on this forum who will tell you to come in with a contractor lunch box or wear a Ltd cufflinks to stay outside IR35.

If you approach this as being a member of the team and do as other perms do then you ll be fine

If you come in and try and be different under the guise of being a contractor and therefore somehow "can deliver" as previous poster mentioned with perms who "cannot" you will suffer

[cntor]

So I've accepted a contract at DB, through an agency - due to start at the end of the month - the money is good, but didn't do my DD and now am wondering whether its a good idea..

Has anyone worked their recently?

[chopper]

On a serious note if you want my view the reason why DB and other bank are in so much trouble is because they hire contractors.

I suspect it is more because they fire permies rather than because they hire contractors. The extremely frequent headcount reduction cycle leads to permies being binned off with massive redundancy payouts, and canned projects. Fast forwards six months, canned projects are restarted from scratch and a new hiring cycle begins to replace the people they binned at massive expense. I knew Barclays permies receiving a six figure payout despite being a couple of years from retirement.

Oh, the outsourcing-insourcing-outsourcing-insourcing cycle will be the other reason.

[cloudy]

well

Cuts cuts cuts. Oh well.

EDIT: and more cuts https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...lysts-get-wary

Aufwiedersehen lieber Freund..

[CoolCat]

DB are in serious trouble mainly as they are stuck with trillions of bad debt so every single cost cutting measure that can be used is & that means IT mainly. German government & EU are clearly propping them up to avoid a massive financial collapse as no-one knows how it would affect the financial markets due to the interconnected debt (most likely it would cause a major collapse as several other banks would take massive losses). Walk on any trade floor in London & mention their name you will usually get similar feedback as its been an open secret for many years now. They are quite literally treading water operating as a zombie company as there is little hope they can ever escape the massive debt they are saddled with caused by their $47 Trillion in toxic derivatives!
https://www.wsj.com/articles/does-de...lem-1475689629
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-d...-idUSKBN14C14J
Deutsche Bank: 5 Things You Should Know | Fortune

So after reading all of that if anyone wants to really work there be prepared for low pay, long hours, frustrating days (due to poor IT investment & general business investment as they have no money for anything). I turned them down several times as I knew it would not be worth a punt as work life balance is also poor. If they paid well it would be a different matter but their contractor salaries are pretty weak compared to others.

yes its open knowledge that they are "at risk" of a financial meltdown, although probably they would get a government bailout

other big issue is that there is a mega infrastructure outsourcing deal with DXC which is in aherm significantly challenging times