Reply to: Contracting in IT for an Investment Bank..

[barry_abs]

Never before have I met such an anal group of people, even the smallest thing was a political nightmare and trying to do anything big, as I was, means having to spend 50% of the time convincing various anal managers

working in the public sector and any big red-tape governed corp is the same, in this country.. crap innit.

[Spacecadet]

The Swiss pride themselves on not being stressed.

Having worked in Geneva, the only people who acted like that were the non swiss (typically the french) who worked there

I think you will find that the swiss pride themselves on being boring and arrogant and think they are far superior to anyone else

Absolutely spot on, even worse though are the strange, strange people who move there permanently because they "fit in" with the Swiss.
Never before have I met such an anal group of people, even the smallest thing was a political nightmare and trying to do anything big, as I was, means having to spend 50% of the time convincing various anal managers that its in their best interests to f'king do something about it.


</rant>

hadn't realised this was an old thread till i read back through it and saw Fleetwoods post

[multiuk]

Are most of you inside IR35 or outside IR35 and are you using own ltd or umbrella company? I'd be interested to hear how UK investment banks and their agencies treat this and what uk contractors are doing.

thanks

[weboo]

Documentation and processes tut tut tut. Working for a particular IB in Zurich, there was no such thing. This roots from developers with those fancy titles having the ability and control over what goes in and out of production systems. So although it was recorded(the changes), docs that are controlled by those brilliant support and infra people never get updated. Which makes life for the next person impossible.

True, I worked with many directors and CIO's.......this means developer or lead developers, 1st line or 2nd line support basically....but having the business cards with that name on, meant they had to wear crappy suits, with tulipty shirts and ties like they were make by infants, topped by shoes only heidi wore back in the early 80's.......then have the front to hand them out every time they half a lager to everyone in the local pub.

[css_jay99]

Currently contracting with Inv Bank and had no previous banking experience, but was lucky as I got the job a good friend.

I work mostly 9 -7 , the permies work even longer !

They also pay good money for the permies as well especially when you get 15% and up bonuses. But what i like best are the fancy Titles for developers and senior developers. They call themselves things like Associate directors / Associate VP ..... I think thats cool on a business card

I find most of the IT permies to be dull boring farts. I think thats what happens when u get radiation from looking at 2 to 4 LCD screens at the same time

Lots of hard work due to urgency which is fine by me, but I find that they lack proper documentation of proceses + you have to go through hoops just to find the right person to speak to on projects.

Most of my development work involves a lot of liaising with the US which is a pain in the backside bcos of the time difference.


There is a lot of networking going on there and its definately an experience worth having on the CV


I know some guy who used to work with another contractor in a US bank and he used to get paid around $800,000 ! No Joke !


Ohh lets not forget the canteen food !, i have already put on a stone in weight.

ahh! some will also do a drug test, so all you coke heads beware !

[weboo]

No longer in Zurich Masterbates. The work was great and the people(expat) also, but family came first and we moved back to the UK...some very difficult circumstances. However, compared to other European countried I have worked in, Zurich tops them by miles....it just did not work out in my case. I have communted before, and if I had no family....Zurich was ace.

For anyone considering a move, if you are single...then great..Zurich is your Oyster....plenty to do, go, see etc etc. With a family like me, can be very difficult...I had the worry of how the family were getting on, on top of starting a contract and without a secured roof above our heads. Things in general take a long time to sort out, kindergardens, nurseries, an apartment for the family, visas for the family and so on...so being patient is key....its completely different to anything here in the UK(now I appreciate it a lot more)

Looking at the original message in this thread...if you are single without any ties, then it can be great. Even with a wife actually it can be good...but kids adds unnecessary stress everywhere. If anyone is thinking of a move into Investment banking, then seriously consider Switzerland..even for 6 months to try. With any Inv. Bank(UBS, CS) on your CV, the Hr dept in charge of filtering CV's WILL take notice I swear...

I did it, wont say how long ago, but it certainly helped me big time. Instead of applying for roles with inv. banking preferred...then getting sorry, no experience so sod off.......I now get, are you available...do you have this, that etc....

My tips in Swizterland are:

1. Even going perm or contract, make sure your agent secures you at least 1 months free accomodation(contract 1-2 months....perm 6 months min). Its very pricey there, a furnished 1 bed apt will cost you between 800-2500 a month!

2. If you have a home in the UK, do not let it out until at leat 3 months is past. that way you'll be sure whether its right for you or not. Things could be tight having two homes....but you get a months free rent at the start, so budget.

3. when looking for an apartment, make sure the agent(who got you there in the first place) take you round in his car....you'll get lost in the first month or so. do not get palmed off by him/her saying we can take you round......yeah right...get him/her to garuntee this before you fly.

4. Eating out, and drinking in are the cheap things to do....its eating in and drinking out that cost....so be aware

5. Make your agent pay for the visas....a family can cost around £100 or so, depending on children

6. Ask your agent about the most cost effective way of PAYE and LPP(this is your compulsary pension)....there are two ways..1st, pay less tax and more pension(which is refunded when you leave), or 2nd pay more tax and less pension.......good if you need money(refundable)

7. The expat community know best, every fiddle there is....like this gem....if you stay for more than 12 months, you can even claim back through swiss Inland Revenue, the interest on your UK mortgage, loans, credit cards etc. so basically network....and network to find out stuff like this.

8. when being paid, dont get palmed off by late payments...by law in Switzerland, after invoice, payment should be made within 48 hours...so take this into account when being promised payment.....BTW, legal cover is free in Switzerland as its included in your salary dedeuctions compulsary.

9. after 6 months you are free agent...swap agents if you like....you can get a better deal.....

10. My last tip....as its such a move, even the flying in for an interview....the agent should pay for the flights....no question........its a big move, whether you are on your own or not..............so no need to be out of pocket...after all a 6 month contract could net the agent 10% of your income....over 6 months, that will pay for the pimps M3's petrol, valet, service and food shopping.....so do not be taken for a ride.

[Gold Dalek]

For my line of work, there seems to be plenty in Zurich. The contractors I worked along side, frequently changed from UBS to citigroup, to Credit Suisse to any other place they chose. I found that once you are there, agents and contractors are a very close nit bunch...everyone knows each other and who has what contracts on the boil....for me, this meant that the agents have a hold on rates..long story.

I looked on jobserve, jobpilot(euro portal) and jobsite.

knit...unless they all have lice in Zurich

[BlasterBates]

Are you still in Zurich weboo ?

[weboo]

For my line of work, there seems to be plenty in Zurich. The contractors I worked along side, frequently changed from UBS to citigroup, to Credit Suisse to any other place they chose. I found that once you are there, agents and contractors are a very close nit bunch...everyone knows each other and who has what contracts on the boil....for me, this meant that the agents have a hold on rates..long story.

I looked on jobserve, jobpilot(euro portal) and jobsite.

[Boolean]

I have pm'd you back!! cheers

[Trimbo]

Boolean - PM sent m8

[Fleetwood]

Cheers BB,
Have worked through MBA, have heard about Elan, but unaware of Swisslinx.

[BlasterBates]

Hi Fleetwood,

Try MBA, SwissLinx aint bad but a bit more tight fisted, steer clear of Elan though

[BlasterBates]

Strange you should say that Weboo, I find the way they speak German makes them sound like country "Yokels" to me, I mean not long ago Switzerland was a poverty stricken country full of farmers...but then again farmers whereever you are, and that includes Britain are funny bunch, so this might be interpreted as "arrogant". They're not like middle class British people, with their noses stuck in the air.

[BlasterBates]

Hi Fleetwood yes there is mainframe work, just need to contact the swiss agencies. It might not appear on Jobserve. French would be an advantage, as there are contracts in Geneva and Fribourg, English is often OK.

The main banks in Zurich have mainframe work in your area.