Next Ventures - Unreasonable Contract Terms

[EricS]

Sorry to dig out the old thread but I have a similar issue and would like to get some more details from Big Bird if at all possible.
Unfortunately as a new member I can not pm him and so I've got a favor to ask.
If a friendly soul would pm Big Bird and kindly ask him to contact me I would much appreciate.

Edit: Thanks to a moderator I was able to write my own pm, thanks.

[cojak]

It took me 3 days of negotiation before they removed the terms and I think it had more to do with the pressure from the client than from me. I wonder what kind of business they want to conduct when they put this kind of terms in the contract and expect the contractors to just take the s***.

Do any other agencies in the UK put up contract like this?

Never seen one that bad.

[psychocandy]

Think about that for while though psycho, what is the definition of unsatisfactory. Client could basically get loads of free work just by saying it isn't good enough.

Yeh. good point. Its not worded that well, is it?

[Big Bird]

It took me 3 days of negotiation before they removed the terms and I think it had more to do with the pressure from the client than from me. I wonder what kind of business they want to conduct when they put this kind of terms in the contract and expect the contractors to just take the s***.

Do any other agencies in the UK put up contract like this?

[TheFaQQer]

sign this contract if you are starving or if you are freezing with no heating. Else just ask the agent to go away and come back with a reasonable contract.

The last thing I'd be signing if I was starving or freezing would be something with seven weeks payment terms where the client and/or agency just say "we're not satisfied" and they keep your money.

[RaLaCon]

without there being a clear definition of what is and what isn't satisfactory.......you could be giving yourself away to free labour......they want you to kiss their -->

[AnthonyQuinn]

Think about that for while though psycho, what is the definition of unsatisfactory. Client could basically get loads of free work just by saying it isn't good enough.

sign this contract if you are starving or if you are freezing with no heating. Else just ask the agent to go away and come back with a reasonable contract.

[JamJarST]

Think I'm right in saying 3c is OK to have in because its good for you for IR35 in any case.

Think about that for while though psycho, what is the definition of unsatisfactory. Client could basically get loads of free work just by saying it isn't good enough.

[psychocandy]

I was recently offerred this contract by Next Ventures, in which I found the following terms disturbing. Do you Brits routinely sign contract with this kind of terms?

2e) Where the Client has signed a Timesheet this shall not be taken to indicate the Client’s satisfaction with the Consultant Company’ work. N-V reserves the right to reduce or cancel the Fees if the Client is dissatisfied with the performance of the Consultant Company or exercises its right to reject the Consultant Company or the Consultant.

3c) The Consultant Company shall rectify any work which is unsatisfactory to N-V or the Client at its own cost.

6f) Save as otherwise expressly provided for in this Agreement if the Consultant fails to fulfil any Notice Period, or the Client proves to N-V’s satisfaction that the services of the Consultant Company and/or the Consultant are unsatisfactory, or if N-V deems that the Consultant’s attitude or demeanour is in breach of the appropriate working terms and conditions of the Client, or is prejudicial to the interests of N-V or the Client during the Term, then N-V reserves the right to terminate this Agreement forthwith and withhold the payment of any outstanding Fees pending an assessment of N-V’s loss. N-V shall not be liable for any Fees from the date of the notice received from the Client regarding the unsatisfactory services to termination of this Agreement. N-V reserves the right to offset any losses sustained as a result of the Consultant Company or the Consultant’s actions, breach or unsatisfactory performance against any Fees due to the Consultant Company.

AT ANY TIME IF AND WHEN NEXT VENTURES EXERCISES ANY OF THESE TERMS, THE CONSULTANT WILL HAVE TO CROSS HIS/HER FINGERS AND HOPE THAT HE/SHE WILL GET HIS/HER 7 WEEKS OF PAY! (1 MONTH BILLING PERIOD + 3 WEEKS PAYMENT TERM)

Think I'm right in saying 3c is OK to have in because its good for you for IR35 in any case.

[cojak]

Dreadful terms - go to B&C or Qdos and they'll get them changed.

I would not take the contract on those terms, there are no safeguards to protect you from unscrupulous agents saying anything and keeping your money.

[TheFaQQer]

2e) Where the Client has signed a Timesheet this shall not be taken to indicate the Client’s satisfaction with the Consultant Company’ work. N-V reserves the right to reduce or cancel the Fees if the Client is dissatisfied with the performance of the Consultant Company or exercises its right to reject the Consultant Company or the Consultant.

No chance. Firstly, what defines dissatisfaction? Secondly, if they sign the timesheet, they accept the work - in the past I have had the following on my timesheets:

I confirm that the hours/days noted have been worked by the consultant and that the work carried out has been completed to the satisfaction of my company. The total hours/days shown may be invoiced to my company at the agreed rate.

Actually, just checking now, two completely different agencies I've used have the exact wording.

3c) The Consultant Company shall rectify any work which is unsatisfactory to N-V or the Client at its own cost.

That's a good IR35 pointer. However, define "unsatisfactory". That said, if you get 2e removed and/or the wording on the timesheet, then that makes this a little irrelevant.

6f) Save as otherwise expressly provided for in this Agreement if the Consultant fails to fulfil any Notice Period, or the Client proves to N-V’s satisfaction that the services of the Consultant Company and/or the Consultant are unsatisfactory, or if N-V deems that the Consultant’s attitude or demeanour is in breach of the appropriate working terms and conditions of the Client, or is prejudicial to the interests of N-V or the Client during the Term, then N-V reserves the right to terminate this Agreement forthwith and withhold the payment of any outstanding Fees pending an assessment of N-V’s loss. N-V shall not be liable for any Fees from the date of the notice received from the Client regarding the unsatisfactory services to termination of this Agreement. N-V reserves the right to offset any losses sustained as a result of the Consultant Company or the Consultant’s actions, breach or unsatisfactory performance against any Fees due to the Consultant Company.

Nope. If your company is unsatisfactory, then there are legal avenues that the agency should pursue to recover their "loss". Define who is going to assess their loss - if it's them, then what is to stop the agency assessing the loss at £1million and keeping all your money?

No way would I be signing it - might be worth engaging Bauer & Cottrell to do a full review and negotiation for you if you want the work.

[craig1]

They're either:

- chancing that you're going to be one of the many contractors who signs anything (yes, there are plenty of them); or
- truly idiotic and thinking that the current market conditions mean they can impose what they see fit.

On the first point, the sole agent that I truly trust was telling me about the number of ex-permie new contractors he's seen who just blindly reply "I accept! Signed versions in the post!" within minutes of getting an offer is silly. They're so desperate for work that they'd sign away their lives without bothering to read it.

[Big Bird]

I was recently offerred this contract by Next Ventures, in which I found the following terms disturbing. Do you Brits routinely sign contract with this kind of terms?

2e) Where the Client has signed a Timesheet this shall not be taken to indicate the Client’s satisfaction with the Consultant Company’ work. N-V reserves the right to reduce or cancel the Fees if the Client is dissatisfied with the performance of the Consultant Company or exercises its right to reject the Consultant Company or the Consultant.

3c) The Consultant Company shall rectify any work which is unsatisfactory to N-V or the Client at its own cost.

6f) Save as otherwise expressly provided for in this Agreement if the Consultant fails to fulfil any Notice Period, or the Client proves to N-V’s satisfaction that the services of the Consultant Company and/or the Consultant are unsatisfactory, or if N-V deems that the Consultant’s attitude or demeanour is in breach of the appropriate working terms and conditions of the Client, or is prejudicial to the interests of N-V or the Client during the Term, then N-V reserves the right to terminate this Agreement forthwith and withhold the payment of any outstanding Fees pending an assessment of N-V’s loss. N-V shall not be liable for any Fees from the date of the notice received from the Client regarding the unsatisfactory services to termination of this Agreement. N-V reserves the right to offset any losses sustained as a result of the Consultant Company or the Consultant’s actions, breach or unsatisfactory performance against any Fees due to the Consultant Company.

AT ANY TIME IF AND WHEN NEXT VENTURES EXERCISES ANY OF THESE TERMS, THE CONSULTANT WILL HAVE TO CROSS HIS/HER FINGERS AND HOPE THAT HE/SHE WILL GET HIS/HER 7 WEEKS OF PAY! (1 MONTH BILLING PERIOD + 3 WEEKS PAYMENT TERM)