Reply to: Personal Questions from agents

[NotAllThere]

You lot are SO cynical after dealing with so much bulltulip from so many agents over the years- no wonder we have this bulltulip sueing culture. >

ftfy

[TykeMerc]

Back on topic I can see why people could be uncomfortable answering personal questions, as TAV said it could have just been some rapport building, but if phrased badly it could easily come across as intrusive.

I shouldn't be surprised at Pogle's post (I don't doubt it either), but in context that must be pretty damned annoying.

[ChrisPackit]

I used to drink with a lad who had to close his Insurance Brokerage after 3 of his 5 staff went on maternity in 1 quarter.

The same happened to me and my business, though not through maternity issues. The whole ordeal is very stressful, and I don't envy anyone in that position...

[TykeMerc]

Personally, I have been in this position a few years ago, where I had the opportunity to employ a youngish girl with no kids / commitments. As a small business employer, and as sad as it is to admit, I didn't employ her due to one of the reasons being I simply couldn't afford to employ her if she were to go off on maternity. This must be a consideration for other small companies too I would guess...

I'm ready for a barrage of 'sexist' comments, but in the real world this is a consideration when the difference is keeping your head above water or not.

It's not sexist, it's a politically incorrect reality of small business. It can and does kill some businesses, I used to drink with a lad who had to close his Insurance Brokerage after 3 of his 5 staff went on maternity in 1 quarter.

[SueEllen]

Strange. I would've thought from an employers point of view, that a more mature lady who has had the kids and they have grown up, would be the more attractive prospect.

Personally, I have been in this position a few years ago, where I had the opportunity to employ a youngish girl with no kids / commitments. As a small business employer, and as sad as it is to admit, I didn't employ her due to one of the reasons being I simply couldn't afford to employ her if she were to go off on maternity. This must be a consideration for other small companies too I would guess...

I'm ready for a barrage of 'sexist' comments, but in the real world this is a consideration when the difference is keeping your head above water or not.

You could say it depends on the size of the employer but really it actually depends on the industry the company is in.

If you are in a company where the turnover your staff is every 1-2 years - and there are legal ways of getting rid of staff - then it's not really a risk.

Also from my friends and acquaintances I know more women who have been pushed out of jobs due to being pregnant who didn't seek redress then did.

Anyway women can have children from when you can legally employ them at 16 until their 50s. I've met a few woman who have had their last child in their late 40s naturally with a large age gap between their other children. Men can be a father at any age.

Personally having employed young people part-time and having worked with young people in different roles, if I had to employ someone permanently full-time I would actually go for someone much older due to reliability. Yes there are some reliable young people out there but the majority I've had the pleasure to work with are not.

[ChrisPackit]

In permie jobs they prefer men with children as they are unlikely to walk out of the job.

With women they prefer it the other way round.

Strange. I would've thought from an employers point of view, that a more mature lady who has had the kids and they have grown up, would be the more attractive prospect.

Personally, I have been in this position a few years ago, where I had the opportunity to employ a youngish girl with no kids / commitments. As a small business employer, and as sad as it is to admit, I didn't employ her due to one of the reasons being I simply couldn't afford to employ her if she were to go off on maternity. This must be a consideration for other small companies too I would guess...

I'm ready for a barrage of 'sexist' comments, but in the real world this is a consideration when the difference is keeping your head above water or not.

[pmeswani]

You lot are SO assuming - no wonder we have this bulltulip sueing culture.

The person was more than likely just building rapport, or feeling the need to make small talk.

The only time I ask this question is when the role is 100's of miles away, and even then it's simply "do you have commitments here which could cause you issues?"

I also ask how old the kids are when I can hear them screaming in the background

God forbid that someone would want to build a relationship and understanding with a person when they are working with them......

<sigh>

Ok, let's assume that the OP is telling the whole facts.

Why should it matter if the guy has 0, 1 or more kids and how old they are? As long as the OP is a responsible parent / adult, that shouldn't be any business of the agent.

There is a clear difference between making small talk and determining whether having any kids should require the agent stop considering an application.

If the agent had asked, "Do you have any family committments that would would prevent you from taking this role?", then fair enough.

Judging by the tone of the OP, it would imply that the agent wasn't really making any small talk, but judging the suitability of a candidate on whether the OP has kids or not.

[The Agents View]

You lot are SO assuming - no wonder we have this bulltulip sueing culture.

The person was more than likely just building rapport, or feeling the need to make small talk.

The only time I ask this question is when the role is 100's of miles away, and even then it's simply "do you have commitments here which could cause you issues?"

I also ask how old the kids are when I can hear them screaming in the background

God forbid that someone would want to build a relationship and understanding with a person when they are working with them......

<sigh>

[SueEllen]

I've lost count of the number of times I was asked during permie interviews if I had children.
If an agency asked me now, I'd tear them off a strip.
The implication is that if you have a family then you are going to be inflexible about location and hours.
I regularly work away from home, so if they've read my CV this will be obvious.
I suspect not many blokes get asked this question though.....

For permie work blokes do get asked that question.

I asked all my male mates loads of times over the years. ( Two of them have listen into calls I've had with agents and can't believe the sh*t that comes out of agents mouths just because I'm a woman.)

In permie jobs they prefer men with children as they are unlikely to walk out of the job.

With women they prefer it the other way round.

However in my last permie position years ago where all loads of the blokes had children, one of the managers got mad because they kept leaving early to put their kids to bed. There as I could leave early to do my various other commitments without him saying anything.

[configman]

Without knowing the context the questions were asked it could be someone just trying to get to know you better or have breathing space whilst they think of a relevant question - or as other posters have said they are asking for more sinister reasons i.e. your ability to work long hours etc. Only the OP will know.

I work in 2 countries UK and China, when asked those questions in UK people always take it as either actual or potential descrimination because it is not a family culture - work comes first so people hide family commitments. In China it is the other way around with family coming first and it pays to promote your family commitments to an interviewer as family is everything. The company knows that if you work long hours another family member will help with the children - not likely in the UK hence why the UK can be biased to people with commitments.

[Pogle]

I've lost count of the number of times I was asked during permie interviews if I had children.
If an agency asked me now, I'd tear them off a strip.
The implication is that if you have a family then you are going to be inflexible about location and hours.
I regularly work away from home, so if they've read my CV this will be obvious.
I suspect not many blokes get asked this question though.....

MonzaMike - you should respond with - yes, i have a family, however as you can see from my CV I am willing to be flexible on location and I also have a very good support system in place for the care of my kids (ie a partner or grandparent!)
Being a parent does not effect my ability to do a good job!
Or something similar.

[SueEllen]

Is it any of their business what my domestic situation is?

Nope

Is this line of questioning even legal?

Nope - falls within sex discrimination laws.

The agent is obviously an idiot as there are easier ways of asking the questions.

All the agent needs to do is state that the client expects you to work in a certain location or certain times.

If I'd replied that I was gay or infertile (I'm neither) then what would the agent say next..

Gay and infertile people can have childcare or caring responsibilities so that's irrelevant.

Wondered if I'd have been better off just saying two kids (regardless of whether this is accurate or not)

Would a white lie have been a better response?

Turn the conversation around and ask them what working hours the client expects and state whether you can meet them.

And be honest - lots of guys don't think they have childcare responsibilities but the fact they put (and are expected to put) their child to bed every night means they have.

[craig1]

Current agency sent a "personal details" form with my contract and had a minor grumble when I refused to complete it. Questions on ethnic/religious/sexuality monitoring, next of kin, national insurance number and so on. I put it bluntly that I'd supply my details only if they supplied theirs. Not heard anything since on it.

[yorkshireman]

I suspect it was a junior employee who has been told to ask some questions for their new CRM system and couldn't disguise it very well.

It may not have been too sinister...

[nomadd]

Would a white lie have been a better response?

Yes. It takes a thief to catch a thief.