Professional working day

[Aptitude]

8hrs with or without breaks?

It gets worse as some clients include lunch in the hours and some don't. So for some clients that could mean 9-5 including 1hr lunch and others mean 9-6 not including 1hr lunch.

[Dark Black]

If I was on a daily rate then I would expect (as a pro) to be able to decide how many hours I needed to work to get the job done. I if do the job quickly then I get to leave early - if I have problems then I stay later. Everyones happy.

Terms like those shown in the OP are out of order - I wouldn't sign up to a contract like that.

[stacks]

just to clarify I am being offered a daily rate.

It might seem a bit petty to some be haggleing over 30 mins but it all adds up and I dont want to be held to ranson to do a min of 8 hours a day which I think is what the current contract terms imply.

Think it's time to pay for a full contract review!

[Xenophon]

PCG Draft Contracts

[Not So Wise]

First off, you don't say if it is a day rate or hourly rate. if hourly and you still object to a 8 hours plus day well your choice is simple, get another gig or stop being a lazy bugger, do the extra hours and smile at payday

If daily, slightly more complicated, what it basically means can be seen in either of the following ways, client is getting a minimum extra 30 mins per day or you are getting slightly less per hour than you thought

Now for the actual terms (if on daily rate), real tricky part, those terms are so open ended that in the worst case scenario client could ask you to do 10 hours days 6/7 days a week (beyond that would say could argue in court that client was being "unreasonable"...unless you speced the project timescales for them...) and you would not be able to claim a penny more.

Though unlikely it is a very bad thing to have in contract without other terms in the contract either limiting what they can demand or increasing your revenue if they go beyond a certain point. Generally good business relations to leave some leeway....but there should always be limits to how much before it starts costing the client more

Crap like this is why I HATE a daily rate and advioded them like the plague for years

[stacks]

So what should the text read to accompany a standard working day?

[KathyWoolfe]

Was the informal agreement verbal? Try to get it into an email.

It doesn't matter what the old contract stated - it's what the new contract says that matters and to which you agree or not.

[VectraMan]

Was the informal agreement verbal? Try to get it into an email.

[stacks]

it's a new contract

[TheFaQQer]

I would suggest it gives the client the right to expect you to work longer than the 8 hours as and when it is required, without any extra fees being charged by your ltd.

That would be my interpretation.

If you are under contract, then both parties would need to agree the change, or is this a new contract / extension?

[malvolio]

I would suggest it's Direction and Control and should be struck out, if only to get out of IR35. It is up to you how many hours are needed to do a given task, that's what a PWD is all about. If they want to dictate hours, you do it on an hourly rate.

[Pickle2]

In my current contract it's just written as a professional working day and I have an informal agreement with the client that this should average out over a week at 37.5 (or 7.5 a day).

Just got a new contract through and it reads -
8 hours (being the estimated number of hours per day for completion of the Project within the Contract Term) or such hours as are reasonably requested by the Client and required for the Project.

Now if they are expecting me to do 8 hours a day over the course of a month they get an extra 1.3 days of my time which I would not be happy with. However the 2nd part of that clause says - or such hours as are reasonably requested by the Client and required for the Project. Does that give me the right to work the hours that I beleive are required and bypass the 8 hours bit?

I would suggest it gives the client the right to expect you to work longer than the 8 hours as and when it is required, without any extra fees being charged by your ltd.

[PorkPie]

If I were you I'd just get the clause removed completely. If the client is happy with your work they won't be asking you to stamp in and stamp out.

[stacks]

In my current contract it's just written as a professional working day and I have an informal agreement with the client that this should average out over a week at 37.5 (or 7.5 a day).

Just got a new contract through and it reads -
8 hours (being the estimated number of hours per day for completion of the Project within the Contract Term) or such hours as are reasonably requested by the Client and required for the Project.

Now if they are expecting me to do 8 hours a day over the course of a month they get an extra 1.3 days of my time which I would not be happy with. However the 2nd part of that clause says - or such hours as are reasonably requested by the Client and required for the Project. Does that give me the right to work the hours that I beleive are required and bypass the 8 hours bit?