Reply to: Looking for UAT testers in Salisbury area

[Ardesco]

I would read that as:

I am not sure how to write the contracts myself and i don't want to pay a professional to do it at this stage so i'm going to steer well clear as I don't really understand it all.

Of course I may be completely wrong

[DodgyAgent]

Not sure DoddyAgent but that would make sense.

Contract law is the major stopping point and then there is getting the company to actually agree and a whole list of others that were pointed out to me about 5 years ago.

Ok point taken from everyone I seem to be wasting my time in this forum but it has been nice chatiing to you all and wish you all the best!

I still am looking for testers regardless for my testing consultancy to offer out to various clients. You got the email address

what has contract law got do with it?

[brobi]

why dont you all just go direct and cut out both middlemen?

Friends Provident (I think )

Michael Hampton (as in little) head of business services or David Smith HR services consultant on 01722318000

Not sure DoddyAgent but that would make sense.

Contract law is the major stopping point and then there is getting the company to actually agree and a whole list of others that were pointed out to me about 5 years ago.

Ok point taken from everyone I seem to be wasting my time in this forum but it has been nice chatiing to you all and wish you all the best!

I still am looking for testers regardless for my testing consultancy to offer out to various clients. You got the email address

[DodgyAgent]

why dont you all just go direct and cut out both middlemen?

Friends Provident (I think )

Michael Hampton (as in little) head of business services or David Smith HR services consultant on 01722318000

[Ardesco]

Yes there are, that's exactly how it works. But each agent will represent only a small number of actors and activelly sell that actor to the client.

This doesn't scale to IT.

tim

Sorry I should have clarified, I meant in the same way agencies in the IT industry work where they will have thousands of resumes and shove anybody they can into the job. Not where they select a small group they think have great potential and then activly try to sell them to clients.

From personal experiance agencies in the media game (acting/modelling/etc) tend to ask you to register for a fixed fee per year and then they will pimp you to thier client base which is fairly static.

[buffdaddy]

Bottom line is, If I am gonna make money as a contractor, I want to reduce the number of middlemen to maximise my income. Whether they be:

an agent,
umbrella company,
a bodyshop,
a contractor who I am sub contracting for,
an "IT Offshorer" (really hate these guys, since they sit in the uk and get paid pounds whilst they pay local rates overseas),
or a company like "CompleteContractor",


what you are doing is providing another middleman service, in a VERY VERY fast market such as IT Contracting. As far as I understand this market, it works very much like an assembly line. It is nothing like the Entertainment or Sporting market where agents only represent certain clients. In this market agents will represent anyone or everyone if they could.

[tim123]

Isn't it illegal to charge a "job seeker" to find work?

No, it's illegal to charge a fee for "offering to find word".

tim

[tim123]

Finally just because it works in other industries doesn't mean it will work in this one. Are there lots of agencies in the acting profession that filter actors out and provide them work for free taking a percentage of the actors wage in return? I don't think so...

Yes there are, that's exactly how it works. But each agent will represent only a small number of actors and activelly sell that actor to the client.

This doesn't scale to IT.

tim

[Lockhouse]

Isn't it illegal to charge a "job seeker" to find work?

[Ardesco]

There are comapnies out there like ics solutions who only use veted quality contractors and I suppose that is the model I am after. They make it very successful and yes they do charge you out at a higher rate than you are getting. So maybe a cut from the piece of the pie might be more profitable...

And that my freind is the slippery slope to becoming agent scum!!!

[brobi]

Well then the pertinent question is how do you remove the chaff from the wheat whilst staying profitable?

I'm sure you have other incomes, but if this is not likely to become a profitable endeavour why are you bothering? (I know I probably sound cynical, but hey, i'm a contractor!! )

Finally just because it works in other industries doesn't mean it will work in this one. Are there lots of agencies in the acting profession that filter actors out and provide them work for free taking a percentage of the actors wage in return? I don't think so...

No there are not but then there are a lot of contractors out there who sturggle on a quarterly basis to get work in on time before their existing contract finishes.

There are comapnies out there like ics solutions who only use veted quality contractors and I suppose that is the model I am after. They make it very successful and yes they do charge you out at a higher rate than you are getting. So maybe a cut from the piece of the pie might be more profitable...

But then I suppose this is a place to gain such knowledge!

[Ardesco]

Well then the pertinent question is how do you remove the chaff from the wheat whilst staying profitable?

I'm sure you have other incomes, but if this is not likely to become a profitable endeavour why are you bothering? (I know I probably sound cynical, but hey, i'm a contractor!! )

Finally just because it works in other industries doesn't mean it will work in this one. Are there lots of agencies in the acting profession that filter actors out and provide them work for free taking a percentage of the actors wage in return? I don't think so...

[brobi]

The main point that you are missing is this.

If I pay you £299 a year I expect my company resume (note it is not a CV) to be put forward for every job that I can do. If you have 30 contractors all capable of doing the same job and the agent only wants 2 people what happens to the other 28? They end up paying you £299 a year for nothing and will not renew. how are you going to explain to me that you did not put my resume forward despite the fact I have paid you a wedge of money to do so?

The idea could work well if you have a small number of experts on your books and a large amount of roles that demanded thier expertise, but in a large commercial sense it will never work. You will not be able to place everybody, the people not placed will shout loudly that the service is rubbish and not renew and your business will suffer accordingly.

Also you are basing it all around making it easy for the agent in one post, and cutting out the agency in another. What exactly are you trying to do?

Finally unless you screen resumes and decline membership request from people who are not experts in your field you are unlikely to get companies seriously interested in looking to you for contractors instead of an agency. They can get 100 poor fits from any agent for free, why get another 100 from you unless quality is guaranteed. Of course this brings back the problem of where are you going to get an income from? highly desireable contractors who are in demand are unlikely to pay you £299 a year when they are doing perfectly well already....

Putting some thought to this and will get back to you as there are some very good points here.

I suppose 1 point to make is that I do not preceive a problem to be with not finding enough work more the case as to quality contractors. There are other benefits that would help contractors and one of those being the tax issues. That alone is worth the tax deduction of the Complete Contractor service.

Also I make money from Sports Arbitrage trading so I don't need this to earn bucket loads of cash. I also contract, look at property investments, have a couple of other successful ventures that run on their own.

Besides the whole set up works for other professions why not this one? I mean there are thousands of actors out there so why dosen't it fall over with that profession? Really I am interested in your knowledge, experience and views...

[Vito]

I have been asked by an agency to advertise non-jobs with a view to harvesting CV's.

I need experts in UHT, PCP, M&S, RBV, TGV, C&A, PNC.

Since I dont know the current rate for anything please indicate what this work might be worth.

Please include a list of your previous clients so I can hound them to eternity.

thanks in advance


PS I will pass your details on to whoever I like.

[Ardesco]

The main point that you are missing is this.

If I pay you £299 a year I expect my company resume (note it is not a CV) to be put forward for every job that I can do. If you have 30 contractors all capable of doing the same job and the agent only wants 2 people what happens to the other 28? They end up paying you £299 a year for nothing and will not renew. how are you going to explain to me that you did not put my resume forward despite the fact I have paid you a wedge of money to do so?

The idea could work well if you have a small number of experts on your books and a large amount of roles that demanded thier expertise, but in a large commercial sense it will never work. You will not be able to place everybody, the people not placed will shout loudly that the service is rubbish and not renew and your business will suffer accordingly.

Also you are basing it all around making it easy for the agent in one post, and cutting out the agency in another. What exactly are you trying to do?

Finally unless you screen resumes and decline membership request from people who are not experts in your field you are unlikely to get companies seriously interested in looking to you for contractors instead of an agency. They can get 100 poor fits from any agent for free, why get another 100 from you unless quality is guaranteed. Of course this brings back the problem of where are you going to get an income from? highly desireable contractors who are in demand are unlikely to pay you £299 a year when they are doing perfectly well already....