Reply to: Politics in the work environment

[BrandNewOne]

One more thing to add. Contractors should do their work only and not get involved in permanent role Drama. Especially if you want to be safe from IR35.

I don't care one whit if anyone hates me or likes me outside my immediate team and the person signing my invoice. I am there to deliver and that is all. London especially is notorious for it's corporate offices being rude and snotty. I hate it and how I survive that BS is being just as rude and snotty. It helps if you want to avoid being overly friendly.

Do your job and go home. Learn if you are lucky and network if you can. No one will fault you if you work hard and deliver even if they don't like you.

[BigDataPro]

This Monday went for a face to face and they asked me 'Why am I a contractor and would I consider a perm role in their company'. My answer was that I am not good in playing politics therefore it wouldn't suit me. Got the contract and am starting next week.

[perplexed]

Contracting is fun because you are there to work and leave. No need to play politics and if you are forced to then it might be best you look elsewhere. I hate office drama so I empathize. Just follow the mantra of keeping it solid and leaving when you are done.

One place I was at the politics was way more fun than the work. It seemed everyone was plotting against each other.

I just stayed neutral, stock response tended to be "I couldn't possibly comment"...

[BrandNewOne]

Hello Ladies & Gents,
First time poster, long time lurker.
Have been having this one going on in my mind for a while, curious how the more seasoned contractors deal with it.
How do you manage to stay away from office politics?
Theoretically contractor status shields you away a bit as you have to keep your eyes on the delivery,away from their 360's, but haven't found it to be always the case.
What seems more likely is that unless you associate with a similar minded group of people and do same agenda(and not related to delivery or professional side of it) in the organization you are most likely to be singled out and turned into a black sheep.
When you think you are out and minding your own business, they pull you back in.
Some of the places might not have been very contractor friendly indeed, deliveries always delayed, loose kpi's, managers focusing more on keeping the impression that "they work their people hard" so it makes it increasingly hard for you to keep delivering and invoicing.
How do you people get on with it?
If i get some time later on maybe i detail on a few episodes just for the fun of it.

Cheers,
Mr G

Contracting is fun because you are there to work and leave. No need to play politics and if you are forced to then it might be best you look elsewhere. I hate office drama so I empathize. Just follow the mantra of keeping it solid and leaving when you are done.

[siphr]

Hello Ladies & Gents,
First time poster, long time lurker.
Have been having this one going on in my mind for a while, curious how the more seasoned contractors deal with it.
How do you manage to stay away from office politics?
Theoretically contractor status shields you away a bit as you have to keep your eyes on the delivery,away from their 360's, but haven't found it to be always the case.
What seems more likely is that unless you associate with a similar minded group of people and do same agenda(and not related to delivery or professional side of it) in the organization you are most likely to be singled out and turned into a black sheep.
When you think you are out and minding your own business, they pull you back in.
Some of the places might not have been very contractor friendly indeed, deliveries always delayed, loose kpi's, managers focusing more on keeping the impression that "they work their people hard" so it makes it increasingly hard for you to keep delivering and invoicing.
How do you people get on with it?
If i get some time later on maybe i detail on a few episodes just for the fun of it.

Cheers,
Mr G

Office politics was the number one factor that pushed me into contracting. I am interested in getting the job done for a fair days pay. Although I do not have a lot of experience yet, I make this clear to the manager or whoever I work with at the very start. I have been dragged into a room, regardless, when somebody needed to vent (unrelated to me) and I just make sure that I sympathise but do not engage.

[LondonManc]

It's not difficult to stay out of politics as a permie or contractor, but a lot of it depends where you're working I'd imagine.

[SandyD]

Sandy, sorry for that, just made a correction.

Consultancies can be sometimes different, from my experience they are an unnecessary level of management. Some of them do offer good connections with clients, more secure than a contractor role. But if you are a decent enough contractor you'd have no need for that.
They do have more traction with upper management... which means additional shield.
Anecdotal story i did hear rumors once that senior management from prev blue chip comp that worked for were favoring Tier one consultancies with the hope of a comfy management role in the consultancy when they retire. If you really want that specific role... might be a better chance.

Some of the places do have a hostile attitude towards contractors, mostly because they tend to be the black sheep of the place, mangers can't have the bad things happening to their people, so they choose some of the contractors to take the heat. Part and parcel of the business, don't take it personal, it's just the game.
Than they tend to put the contractors in the bad light so the permies don't aspire to it... build a bit more on the black sheep story - taking all the money, doing less work, just because you refuse to involve in the fluffy managerial stuff they are so attached to.
Moral of it is: if there isn't a black sheep around than they make one.

Quick story: I was once in a role with a blue chip company and the team was responsible of giving predictions of efficiency for a product they were selling.
There was a task being moved around and no one from the team would sign it off, in the end it ended up with me and i confronted my manager that the data that they we were using to back it up was not only unreliable but pretty sure fabricated.(didn't point to him last point but he was for sure aware)
After a week or two of persistence from my supervisor i was finally taken to a room and told that if i don't push it through he was going to ask to my consultancy to replace me.
I didn't and next thing i am in a room with my immediate 2 managers talking about "creating conflicts to the client".
I repeated them the hole story and pretty sure they were on same boat with my thinking but after i finished they said: "you are creating a conflict with the client"
So in the end their answer was clear. Hanged my hat and was on my way out.
Apparently that team was responsible for spitting out numbers that back managerial decisions, my fault for not figuring it out earlier.
Got replaced by candidate with visa requirement and less mobility.

This is what I like about contracting, I don't take much sh$t now, client trying to get me to falsify something (yes had a few wanting me to falsify or white lie about something like test results)
Client treating me badly, client trying to get me to do everyone else's job... then am off ...

Maybe not a great attitude, but after so many years am at a stage life and work experience when I can afford it ! in the past due to personal responsibilities I had to shut my mouth ..
But not any longer.

I think personal support, like someone you trust and you can speak with, like a personal mentor/relative etc that you can vent to and they can give you honest and good advice does help... sometimes when one is in the thick of an bad situation, its difficult to make best decisions.

[WLB2018]

Oooo I love this sort of thing!

I love to get involved, spread false rumours and generally cause as much chaos as possible!

I jest of course!

Just be as professional as you can, avoid entering into conversations or rhetoric that cause cause you issues, worse case simply state you a contractor and here to do a specific job so cannot give or offer advice that would look like you were siding with a particular view (caveat that with assuming its not directly related to the job you are there to do!)

WLB

[GigiBronz]

Sandy, sorry for that, just made a correction.

Consultancies can be sometimes different, from my experience they are an unnecessary level of management. Some of them do offer good connections with clients, more secure than a contractor role. But if you are a decent enough contractor you'd have no need for that.
They do have more traction with upper management... which means additional shield.
Anecdotal story i did hear rumors once that senior management from prev blue chip comp that worked for were favoring Tier one consultancies with the hope of a comfy management role in the consultancy when they retire. If you really want that specific role... might be a better chance.

Some of the places do have a hostile attitude towards contractors, mostly because they tend to be the black sheep of the place, mangers can't have the bad things happening to their people, so they choose some of the contractors to take the heat. Part and parcel of the business, don't take it personal, it's just the game.
Than they tend to put the contractors in the bad light so the permies don't aspire to it... build a bit more on the black sheep story - taking all the money, doing less work, just because you refuse to involve in the fluffy managerial stuff they are so attached to.
Moral of it is: if there isn't a black sheep around than they make one.

Quick story: I was once in a role with a blue chip company and the team was responsible of giving predictions of efficiency for a product they were selling.
There was a task being moved around and no one from the team would sign it off, in the end it ended up with me and i confronted my manager that the data that they we were using to back it up was not only unreliable but pretty sure fabricated.(didn't point to him last point but he was for sure aware)
After a week or two of persistence from my supervisor i was finally taken to a room and told that if i don't push it through he was going to ask to my consultancy to replace me.
I didn't and next thing i am in a room with my immediate 2 managers talking about "creating conflicts to the client".
I repeated them the hole story and pretty sure they were on same boat with my thinking but after i finished they said: "you are creating a conflict with the client"
So in the end their answer was clear. Hanged my hat and was on my way out.
Apparently that team was responsible for spitting out numbers that back managerial decisions, my fault for not figuring it out earlier.
Got replaced by candidate with visa requirement and less mobility.

[MonkeysUncle]

At the place am at now, they quite openly talk in front of us contractors about how they despise contractor mentality, tell us all contractors care about is money etc etc, they can't see how lazy most of the perm team is, and how unwilling they are to do anything new... thick skin !!

Literally had this same experience on Monday. Stuck in a meeting with permies and me and one other contractor.
All just talking about budget budget budget and how its because of contractors we have no money now and the permie team dont get an opportunity to learn anything or take part.

When in fact its the complete opposite....the reason they have had to bring in contractors is because the permies dont want to learn or step up!
Its typical public sector thinking I find....."I dont want to learn something new because I might need to take responisbility for it or be asked to get involved. I just want to sit in my corner, do what I have been doing for the last 8 years and not be bothered"

[MrButton]

Also.

If you have to take sides don’t side with the guy in the mail room pissing everyone off and is about to retire even if he just seems like a cool guy.

Side with the hiring manager, decision maker, influencer etc.

[vwdan]

Yes certainly in the last 10 years or so the anti-contractor sentiment is hardly visible, not sure why my present place - even though its a large bank and there are plenty of contractors feel free to be openly anti-contractor.

Jealousy

[SandyD]

Psst, so did I



I'm not disputing your experience, but any anti-contractor sentiment I've seen has been fairly mild. For the most part I've felt valued and appreciated in the same way as I did as a permie consultant - certainly nothing to that level.

Yes certainly in the last 10 years or so the anti-contractor sentiment is hardly visible, not sure why my present place - even though its a large bank and there are plenty of contractors feel free to be openly anti-contractor.

[vwdan]

Not entirely correct, I used to be a consultant prior to contracting,

Psst, so did I

the way a client treats a consultant is entirely different

To a degree, sure, but broadly I think how you behave has a huge impact on how you're treated. I've always introduced myself as a consultant and I've always worked on projects on much the same basis as I did with a consultancy behind me. Act like a bum on a seat contractor and I imagine you'll be treated like one.

after being well respected and listened to as a consultant from top consultancy ... suddenly I was a contractor slave, treated as a sub-human category... yeh whatever, I kept my head down and took my daily rate... then moved on!
...
At the place am at now, they quite openly talk in front of us contractors about how they despise contractor mentality, tell us all contractors care about is money etc etc, they can't see how lazy most of the perm team is, and how unwilling they are to do anything new... thick skin !!

I'm not disputing your experience, but any anti-contractor sentiment I've seen has been fairly mild. For the most part I've felt valued and appreciated in the same way as I did as a permie consultant - certainly nothing to that level.

[vwdan]

Unfortunately how i perceive it and how is probably the case for most of the people in here, current field does not offer many opportunities to develop and grow into an organization without shifting from technical to more politics/managerial side of it so contracting seems the optimal way forward for me.

Personally, I think you're looking at this wrong. When I go into a company, I don't do so looking for promotion or the ability to insert myself into other projects. My goal is to be "Dan the awesome consultant we had".

I want to be in peoples phone books, I want to be somebody they remember. When I left my last place, the MD had been trying to get me in as a permie for months and as I said goodbye he laughed and joked "Ah, you'll be back in a couple of weeks". That's my aim in every contract - I don't *want* the permie job, or to stay there, but I want them to want me to. Because those are the people who are going to call in six months time with another project, or give my name to their contacts when they ask if they know a good engineer. Or, at the very least, leave a kick-ass multi paragraph LinkedIn recommendation.