Tax avoidance "morally repugnant"?

[Bumfluff]

Perhaps. But it's easy to see how this sort of reporting occurs. On the one hand, "tax avoidance" is an amorphous concept and there is a feeling among the general public, milked by the press, that people should PAYE their fare share (sorry), especially during a time of austerity. On the other hand, IR35 is an obscure and unintelligible area of tax law and the press is filled with so-called experts that are spreading blatant falsehoods about the content and implementation of IR35. It's really no surprise, then, that the vacuum is filled with catchy headlines and shoddy reporting rather than balanced analysis.

Press, public and MPs seem to have forgotten that MPs were given exemption from certain tax avoidance rules may be its time the press were reminded lets put the ball back in the MP's court MPs given exemption from tax avoidance rules - Telegraph

[jamesbrown]

Is it just me or is UK plc losing the plot?

Perhaps. But it's easy to see how this sort of reporting occurs. On the one hand, "tax avoidance" is an amorphous concept and there is a feeling among the general public, milked by the press, that people should PAYE their fare share (sorry), especially during a time of austerity. On the other hand, IR35 is an obscure and unintelligible area of tax law and the press is filled with so-called experts that are spreading blatant falsehoods about the content and implementation of IR35. It's really no surprise, then, that the vacuum is filled with catchy headlines and shoddy reporting rather than balanced analysis.

[Swamp Thing]

2400 public sector workers under investigation for tax avoidance via a PSC Leading article: A shameful tax avoidance culture - Leading Articles - Opinion - The Independent

The 'Independent'? The article is so unbalanced it beggars belief. The "tax avoidance" being hyped up by the media is no more than a ltd company being tax efficient within current rules for PAYE, dividends etc. If the government is not happy with the rules, then they need to change them and clarify for us, not bang on about tax avoidance. And there's the rub: when the govt starts a full tax review on this, the wiser voices will point out that small businesses (the "engines of growth in the UK" - Gordon Brown) will change their operating model.

The first change may be that contractors take their services away from the public sector because it's too troublesome to operate in. The private sector market for good specialists isn't that dire. Perhaps then, folks like Danny Alexander will tone down the rhetoric because they need supply of specialists to deliver their projects. Presumably that's why 2,400 contractors are there in the first place FFS.

The next change could be a rise in day rates to retain those contractors who haven't flown to the private sector. The rise being necessary to absorb the extra cost of PAYE and NICs being deducted at source. And how would the government be saving cost there?

The next change could be a rise in day rates in private sector too, because let's face it, the government really wants to scratch this itch now. Hanging and flogging tax avoiding contractors? It's a populist vote winner!

I have always provided services in the private sector, and have occasionally though about public sector. Colleagues have previously put me off saying that the bureaucracy would do my head in. Well, they can add to that this latest fiasco. I wouldn’t touch public sector now or in the future for all the tea in China, and I expect a lot of contractors/specialists/ltd companies/off-payroll workers (choose your term) will be thinking the same way.

[BolshieBastard]

Most of those 2400 will have been 'allowed' or 'forced' to operate via a limited co to reduce Central Government costs on civil service pay and numbers.

Since they effectively force these people out, they are now complaining that they are working through Limited co and not being permanent staff on the pay role.

I wish they'd make their minds up what they want!

[doomage]

Oops missed that - haven't ventured over there today yet

Agreed it it totally tulip reporting but it also seems to be reflective of the current mood in the UK - the papers would have you believe that there are fat cat gazillionaires who pay no tax whatsoever and live a life of complete depravity or salt of the earth, working class saints who are supporting the fat cats through the sweat of their brow for no thanks and ever decreasing wages and absolutely nothing in between.

Is it just me or is UK plc losing the plot?

It's just the media. Keep calm and keep invoicing.

And be ready to run back home to NZ when the tulip hits the fan...

[LisaContractorUmbrella]

KUATB

Although this one is in the right forum for discussion I will re-post what I put for comment...

Typical tulip reporting....

If they are working for limited companies they should not be on the payroll and are not civil servants. They are companies providing a service. The title should have read something along the lines of Govt employing the services of 2400 consultants...

I would be willing to bet that a large majority of these 2400 didn't have the option to go on payroll because they are contractors.

Some of the reporting around all this has been mediocre at best but this takes the biscuit. Completely out of context IMO.

Oops missed that - haven't ventured over there today yet

Agreed it it totally tulip reporting but it also seems to be reflective of the current mood in the UK - the papers would have you believe that there are fat cat gazillionaires who pay no tax whatsoever and live a life of complete depravity or salt of the earth, working class saints who are supporting the fat cats through the sweat of their brow for no thanks and ever decreasing wages and absolutely nothing in between.

Is it just me or is UK plc losing the plot?

[LisaContractorUmbrella]

They just need to operate inside IR35 then 'via their ltd company', for most it will give them more £ in there pocket then a brolly for me its a good few £k, plus no additional third party brolly who could go belly up getting there mits on the £.

their

[Clare@InTouch]

The actual report itself is here, if interested: http://www.hm-treasury.gov.uk/d/tax_...iew_230512.pdf

[scooby]

2400 public sector workers under investigation for tax avoidance via a PSC Leading article: A shameful tax avoidance culture - Leading Articles - Opinion - The Independent

And all of a sudden you can see the line of contractors starting to build as they start explaining IR35, MOO, D&C and substitution to their clients... The start of the culture change and the move to acting as a real B2B relationship is about to start. And its about to hit the Public sector first! Those who are tying to clamp down on the very hand that is feeding them...

At least the rest of us might get a break before being investigated, as these guys are the easy target.

[Bumfluff]

2400 public sector workers under investigation for tax avoidance via a PSC Leading article: A shameful tax avoidance culture - Leading Articles - Opinion - The Independent

They just need to operate inside IR35 then 'via their ltd company', for most it will give them more £ in there pocket then a brolly for me its a good few £k, plus no additional third party brolly who could go belly up getting there mits on the £.

[northernladuk]

KUATB

Although this one is in the right forum for discussion I will re-post what I put for comment...

Typical tulip reporting....

If they are working for limited companies they should not be on the payroll and are not civil servants. They are companies providing a service. The title should have read something along the lines of Govt employing the services of 2400 consultants...

I would be willing to bet that a large majority of these 2400 didn't have the option to go on payroll because they are contractors.

Some of the reporting around all this has been mediocre at best but this takes the biscuit. Completely out of context IMO.

[LisaContractorUmbrella]

2400 public sector workers under investigation for tax avoidance via a PSC Leading article: A shameful tax avoidance culture - Leading Articles - Opinion - The Independent