Reply to: Agency not paying on time

[TheFaQQer]

Well we won't know that until hugeBrain tells us

I await with bated breath

[Ardesco]

Unless the contract states that a different jurisdiction is in place.

Well we won't know that until hugeBrain tells us

[TheFaQQer]

For all the one post wonders going on about Swiss law, it doesn't make a blind bit of difference if the contract is signed in the UK with a UK agency under English law.

Unless the contract states that a different jurisdiction is in place.

[ratewhore]

If you are under contract to deliver something, then not delivering it makes you in breach of contract.

Most contracts I've seen are T & M. As PAH says, if I work, I have certain contractual obligations to fulfil in order to get paid. There's certainly nothing in my contracts to force me to work...

[Ardesco]

For all the one post wonders going on about Swiss law, it doesn't make a blind bit of difference if the contract is signed in the UK with a UK agency under English law.

If the contract does not state that some of the funds will be witheld until the end of contract/year then they can't do it. If they do do it they are in breach use the late payment legislation to screw them up and once they owe you more than £750 tell them to pay up now or you will hit them with a winding up order.

Liquidation or pay you, which one do you think they will choose?

If they are trying this on without having clauses in the contract to back them up they do not have a leg to stand on, part of the reason for going through an agency is the factoring process where you get your money quickly while they hassle the end client for it. If they can't get the money off the end client it is not your problem, your contract is wth them and they have to pay within the timescales written into your contract.

[shark]

Are you retarded? Since you seem so keen on putting up other people's private details, why not post my home address on the internet as well?

I thought they were keeping back 6-7 weeks' pay until the end of the year - if it's less than that then it might not be too bad.

Hugebrain.. you said in an earlier post you were moving to Switzerland, so it's obvious you're talking about the Swiss UBS Harvey Nash contract.

You've jumped the gun with your complaint, holidays are paid out when you take them, the only people that have to wait for their monthly deduction to be repaid at the end of the year are those that take no holidays.
For most people the deduction makes no difference, & some will even be better off if they take their holidays earlier.

[MarillionFan]

Are you retarded? Since you seem so keen on putting up other people's private details, why not post my home address on the internet as well?

I thought they were keeping back 6-7 weeks' pay until the end of the year - if it's less than that then it might not be too bad.

Oh Dear(TM). Can we assume Hugebrain that you started posting stuff on a bulletin board without actually checking with the agency what the real deal was.

You work in IT don't you.

Please read here....http://forums.contractoruk.com/gener...lk-people.html

[TheFaQQer]

Not sure if that's true, can't remember seeing a clause in any of my contracts saying I had to 'work', just that if I did 'work' they would pay x for an amount of my time until date y.

Certainly up till now I've had no problems telling the agency after the event when I've had holidays or 'time off', obviously informing the client beforehand where possible.

Maybe I'm a contractor and not a temp or disguised employee.

From what I know if I failed to turn up to the client site without informing them they could claim breach of contract with the agency.

I certainly wouldn't continue 'working' if there was any doubt about the agency paying me, I've been taken for that mug once and there won't be a second time.

If you are under contract to deliver something, then not delivering it makes you in breach of contract.

I don't know what the contract the OP signed says, though.

[TheFaQQer]

One extra thing to check (depending on whether other comments in this thread are true or not) is what the applicable law is - most contracts have a clause that removes any ambiguity, e.g. "This contract shall be governed by the law of England and Wales".

Not knowing what the jurisdiction is might make any advice here completely irrelevant.

[PAH]

If you stop working, then there is a chance that they could come after you for breach of contract

Not sure if that's true, can't remember seeing a clause in any of my contracts saying I had to 'work', just that if I did 'work' they would pay x for an amount of my time until date y.

Certainly up till now I've had no problems telling the agency after the event when I've had holidays or 'time off', obviously informing the client beforehand where possible.

Maybe I'm a contractor and not a temp or disguised employee.

From what I know if I failed to turn up to the client site without informing them they could claim breach of contract with the agency.

I certainly wouldn't continue 'working' if there was any doubt about the agency paying me, I've been taken for that mug once and there won't be a second time.

[hugebrain]

OK....

Are you retarded? Since you seem so keen on putting up other people's private details, why not post my home address on the internet as well?

I thought they were keeping back 6-7 weeks' pay until the end of the year - if it's less than that then it might not be too bad.

[nobby]

OK, so you guys don't waste too much time worrying about this - you are indeed missing some background info. Towards end of 2009 UBS in Switzerland 'forced' a large group of contractors to work though HN as a single payrolling agency. The contract they were presented with included strange concepts such as witholding of a percentage of earnings so that it could be used to 'pay' for public holidays, holidays etc. and enforced purchase of sickpay insurance. The detailed terms of some of this were not written into the contract, but communicated verbally - many contractors did not like what had been communicated, some appear to have misunderstood, but many signed anyway. The OP appears to be referring to the witholding of earnings (approx.3.4%) that is for payment of public holidays - ordinarily a contractor may expect to earn nothing on a public holiday, but HN like to withold this percentage then 'pay' the public holiday from it to appear to be more compliant with Swiss law which says public holidays should be paid. Unfortunately, their decision initially (which is currently under review) was that if they paid that witholding during the period of the contract, it would cause problems (irregularity of holidays across the year etc), so they proposed payment of public holidays only at contract or year end. This I think is what the OP is complaining about - although he's really just trying to whip up a storm of discontent regarding HN, hence the lack of transparency in his post. I don't wish to defend HN (they appear to be rather in a muddle in zurich at least) but you shouldn't take this complaint out of context.

[TheFaQQer]

My agency (Harvey Nash) has sent me an email saying they don't intend to pay on time as specified in the contract, and that I may have to wait for up to ten months for money they have agreed to pay in around two weeks.

What's the best procedure for dealing with this?

I presume that they are not in breach of contract just by sending an email, so I would have to wait until a payment is actually late before I do anything. Then they would be in breach of contract.

Apart from making noises at this stage, there is nothing that you can do legally until they are in breach. Start now, though, and check what your rights will be if they do breach the contract. Speak to the agency, speak to the client, read the contract - can you give notice?

Should I just stop working then, or should I send them a letter saying that If I don't receive payment in a certain number of days or I will consider the contract as terminated.

Delay in payment is probably not a sufficient enough breach to be able to terminate the contract - it depends on whether it's a breach of conditions or a breach of warranty. If you stop working, then there is a chance that they could come after you for breach of contract, which isn't quite what you want.

What happens regarding notice periods? I assume that I won't have to give them a month's notice if they are not fulfilling their side of the contract.

I wouldn't assume anything without speaking to a lawyer - if you are in the PCG then speak to their legal helpline.

[wantacontract]

hmm, I've just been contacted by Harvey Nash for a role.....but it wasn't what i was looking for...

man, I'll be jumping up and down if I was told to wait for 10 months!

[ratewhore]

I'll stick my oar in too.

First, what does your contract say?

Second, if there are no provisions for this in the contract (which I can't see for the life of me why there would be), legislation allows for 30 days to be used as standard payment terms. So, go to http://www.payontime.co.uk and follow their guidance.

Essentially, if they have not paid an invoice within 30 days, and there are no explicit payment terms in your contract, you can send them a letter detailing a penalty and interest, which racks up daily. This is the law, I have used it before, and I got it paid.

Finally, if it were me, I would be looking for a new gig or, at least, looking to take the agency out of the equation.