Reply to: DIY End of Year Accounts

[fidot]

like this - alan@broomaffinity.com



Only joking obviously. Will be in touch Alan.

Thanks

No, not like that - you have missed an "e"

[northernladuk]

Instead of it making 1% from Aldermore it's making 2.5% from You(personally)

vs it making 1% while You(personally) throw 3-4-5% away to a bank

long term it's no contest! YourCo takes the money from you rather than the bank

I'd love to see a proper side by side comparison of the actual cost in pennies to someone to go down either route. It's so complicated once you start involving the tax, lost interest and so on. I'm sure it will come out in favour of the company loan (assuming the person has a decent accountant so isn't going to balls up at some point) but I'll bet it's a lot closer than we realise. When we throw numbers around on here it doesn't get us anywhere closer to the truth. Both numbers in that top line are incorrect so not giving us a clear picture.

Have any of our accountants provided a true cost model to any of their clients they could share?

[pr1]

I'm talking about the fact you are losing out on the interest on that money while it's out of your account. You'll get it back yes but will have lost the interest over the period surely?

As I stated each line item might not come to much but roll it all up together it starts to make a difference to whole picture.

Instead of it making 1% from Aldermore it's making 2.5% from You(personally)

vs it making 1% while You(personally) throw 3-4-5% away to a bank

long term it's no contest! YourCo takes the money from you rather than the bank

[northernladuk]

!!

I'm talking about the fact you are losing out on the interest on that money while it's out of your account. You'll get it back yes but will have lost the interest over the period surely?

As I stated each line item might not come to much but roll it all up together it starts to make a difference to whole picture.

[pr1]

Plus the tax on withdrawing it out of the company
And the loss of interest from not only the loan money not being in his account but the 25% tax as well.

you only pay the 25% additional corp tax once, and you get it back when the loan is repaid so long term is cost neutral

!!

[northernladuk]

he'll pay CT on the interest that he (personally) is paying to his company, so 19% of the 2.5% interest is lost vs the whole 2.5% being lost if he was paying a bank (assuming he could get a 30k loan for 2.5% from a bank)

you only pay the 25% additional corp tax once, and you get it back when the loan is repaid so long term is cost neutral

Plus the tax on withdrawing it out of the company
And the loss of interest from not only the loan money not being in his account but the 25% tax as well. Aldermore savings for 3 years is paing 1.65%, for 5 years is 2%.
And I'm sure there will be other stuff I haven't thought of.

It might look attractive in a simple one liner but if you look at the full picture it doesn't seem quite as attractive, particularly when the OP is struggling with the accounting side. Only needs one mess up and he's worse off, if he isn't already.

Good point about what rate he'd actually get from a bank though. That might tip it but we aren't talking a big saving.

[pr1]

Nope. Same deadline for both

https://www.gov.uk/prepare-file-annu...imited-company

ah... confusion between annual tax return, annual return and confirmation statement

https://www.gov.uk/running-a-limited...-annual-return
When it’s due
You’ll get an email alert or a reminder letter to your company’s registered office when your confirmation statement is due.

The due date is usually a year after either:

the date your company incorporated
the date you filed your last annual return or confirmation statement
You can file your confirmation statement up to 14 days after the due date.

[pr1]

But you'll pay CT on the interest and then further tax as you take it out won't you?

he'll pay CT on the interest that he (personally) is paying to his company, so 19% of the 2.5% interest is lost vs the whole 2.5% being lost if he was paying a bank (assuming he could get a 30k loan for 2.5% from a bank)

you only pay the 25% additional corp tax once, and you get it back when the loan is repaid so long term is cost neutral

[ladymuck]

think annual return is due to CH sooner?

Nope. Same deadline for both

https://www.gov.uk/prepare-file-annu...imited-company

[pr1]

Yes, you have 9 months. However, the sooner you get your affairs in order, the sooner you know what your liability is and the longer you have time to save up (assuming you don't have a ring-fenced kitty you chuck money into on a regular basis) to pay the bill, which is due at the end of that 9 month period.

think annual return is due to CH sooner?

[ladymuck]

Another quick question. In terms of time to complete my annual return and corp tax, i've got approx 9 months after my year end to submit anything to HMRC and CH don't I? So I have to time to look into all this given my end of year is 31/10?

Thanks

Yes, you have 9 months. However, the sooner you get your affairs in order, the sooner you know what your liability is and the longer you have time to save up (assuming you don't have a ring-fenced kitty you chuck money into on a regular basis) to pay the bill, which is due at the end of that 9 month period.

[northernladuk]

Another quick question. In terms of time to complete my annual return and corp tax, i've got approx 9 months after my year end to submit anything to HMRC and CH don't I? So I have to time to look into all this given my end of year is 31/10?

Thanks

I'd ask my accountant Alan. I'm sure he'll tell you it's not approx...

[northernladuk]

Thanks for that clarity as I understood there was a 25% temporary tax which I eventually got back. Worrying thing is that when I asked my accountant if this was true they said no but they'd check. Eventually came back and said "oh yeah, you're right".

Not only am I not paying interest to a bank, but the interest I would have normally paid on a bank loan i'm putting into a fund. Obviously this can go the other way but i'm hoping over the medium to long term that this investment pays for the depreciation on the car and the interest due to My company. Time will tell.

But you'll pay CT on the interest and then further tax as you take it out won't you?

[busgrw]

Another quick question. In terms of time to complete my annual return and corp tax, i've got approx 9 months after my year end to submit anything to HMRC and CH don't I? So I have to time to look into all this given my end of year is 31/10?

Thanks

[busgrw]

Is that true? 2.5% interest paid back into your company (not "lost" to a bank)

Slight cashflow drop for the 25% temporary corporation tax but YourCo gets that back once it's paid up - can't see how it would have been "nearly as cheap"? - He'll have saved enough to pay his new accountant

Thanks for that clarity as I understood there was a 25% temporary tax which I eventually got back. Worrying thing is that when I asked my accountant if this was true they said no but they'd check. Eventually came back and said "oh yeah, you're right".

Not only am I not paying interest to a bank, but the interest I would have normally paid on a bank loan i'm putting into a fund. Obviously this can go the other way but i'm hoping over the medium to long term that this investment pays for the depreciation on the car and the interest due to My company. Time will tell.