Reply to: UTR problems

[VillageContractor]

HMRC are amusing. Mrs VC spent an hour on Friday kicking off (I feel sorry for whoever was on the other end) to be told that they will process it that day and it would be given to her on Saturday over the phone.

She calls up today and there is no record of her call on Friday and no UTR... again the promise of it being done today and available tomorrow.

[ladymuck]

There's no need to register just because you're just a director or shareholder, but you do have a responsibility to notify HMRC of any untaxed income. HMRC will not request a tax return unless something on their system flags you up as needing one and they can't guess if you've got untaxed income. Failure to notify HMRC by 6 October following the end of the tax year in which you owe tax could result in a penalty.

This doesn't have to necessarily mean registering for SA, if the tax owed is below a certain threshold it can sometimes be collected through your tax code. But you are supposed to notify them.

That being said, unless OP's wife received dividends over the higher rate tax threshold for 15/16, she shouldn't owe any tax. But she probably will for 16/17 due to the new dividend tax changes so would have had to register sooner or later.

Fair point. I had a hunch I'd misread/misinterpreted something.

[TheCyclingProgrammer]

Employment sheet?

A supplementary sheet to the main tax return. One is required per employment or paid directorship.

[TheCyclingProgrammer]

Wrong. Check https://www.gov.uk/check-if-you-need-a-tax-return or https://www.gov.uk/self-assessment-t...d-a-tax-return.

Do we really have to do this again? I'm aware of what the HMRC guidance says. It has no legal basis whatsoever. Taxpayers only have a legal obligation to notify HMRC of any untaxed income and submit a return if they receive a notice to file one. S7, Taxes Management Act 1970. Do a search.

[VillageContractor]

I'm guessing she's also employed. Remember she'll need to fill out an employment sheet as well if she is. The return itself should be fairly simple and should only take half hour.

Employment sheet?

[Kugel]

There's no need to register just because you're just a director or shareholder, but you do have a responsibility to notify HMRC of any untaxed income.

Wrong. Check https://www.gov.uk/check-if-you-need-a-tax-return or https://www.gov.uk/self-assessment-t...d-a-tax-return.

[TheCyclingProgrammer]

I *think* she is on the higher rate so owes some tax.

I'm guessing she's also employed. Remember she'll need to fill out an employment sheet as well if she is. The return itself should be fairly simple and should only take half hour.

[VillageContractor]

There's no need to register just because you're just a director or shareholder, but you do have a responsibility to notify HMRC of any untaxed income. HMRC will not request a tax return unless something on their system flags you up as needing one and they can't guess if you've got untaxed income. Failure to notify HMRC by 6 October following the end of the tax year in which you owe tax could result in a penalty.

This doesn't have to necessarily mean registering for SA, if the tax owed is below a certain threshold it can sometimes be collected through your tax code. But you are supposed to notify them.

That being said, unless OP's wife received dividends over the higher rate tax threshold for 15/16, she shouldn't owe any tax. But she probably will for 16/17 due to the new dividend tax changes so would have had to register sooner or later.

I *think* she is on the higher rate so owes some tax.

[TheCyclingProgrammer]

This was discussed on another thread recently I think (or it might have been on the IPSE forums)

There's no need to voluntarily to register for SA. If HMRC think they're missing out, they'll tell you to register. I would have waited for that.

There's no need to register just because you're just a director or shareholder, but you do have a responsibility to notify HMRC of any untaxed income. HMRC will not request a tax return unless something on their system flags you up as needing one and they can't guess if you've got untaxed income. Failure to notify HMRC by 6 October following the end of the tax year in which you owe tax could result in a penalty.

This doesn't have to necessarily mean registering for SA, if the tax owed is below a certain threshold it can sometimes be collected through your tax code. But you are supposed to notify them.

That being said, unless OP's wife received dividends over the higher rate tax threshold for 15/16, she shouldn't owe any tax. But she probably will for 16/17 due to the new dividend tax changes so would have had to register sooner or later.

[Alan @ BroomeAffinity]

This was discussed on another thread recently I think (or it might have been on the IPSE forums)

There's no need to voluntarily to register for SA. If HMRC think they're missing out, they'll tell you to register. I would have waited for that.

I disagree. The responsibility is with the taxpayer. Otherwise there's a Failure to Notify risk.

[ladymuck]

Thanks folks - HMRC had said as much but I've lost faith in what they say

Yes, the wife is a shareholder so she should probably pay some tax on her dividends.

This was discussed on another thread recently I think (or it might have been on the IPSE forums)

There's no need to voluntarily to register for SA. If HMRC think they're missing out, they'll tell you to register. I would have waited for that.

[VillageContractor]

Thanks folks - HMRC had said as much but I've lost faith in what they say

Yes, the wife is a shareholder so she should probably pay some tax on her dividends.

[Michael at BI Accountancy]

If she doesn't have a UTR she wouldn't have received a notice to file a tax return yet, so I wouldn't worry about it being "late". I believe you get 3 months from receipt of the notice to file, even if that is later than 31 Jan.

WHS

[Neil@Intouch]

I believe so. They simply said they're investigating it and someone will call her back, they call back and say it will be done in two weeks. Then she complained and it's now call back in 1 week.

Hopefully they do sort this issue out for you within the timescale, but as TheCyclingProgrammer confirms you do have some breathing space if you receive the notice to file a tax return now, or at a later date and will avoid the penalties if filed by the stated timescale on the notice.

[TheCyclingProgrammer]

If she doesn't have a UTR she wouldn't have received a notice to file a tax return yet, so I wouldn't worry about it being "late". I believe you get 3 months from receipt of the notice to file, even if that is later than 31 Jan. If you registered back in October then you shouldn't get a penalty for late notification anyway.

Why did she have to register, did she have untaxed income the in 15/16 tax year?