MPs vote down bid to delay IR35 reforms, press ahead with new tax rules

[Lockhouse]

Also it won't be too long before the deliberate creation of a class of worker with zero employment rights rears its ugly head. That is actually the most likely driver for future changes.

Blimey, we agree.

[elsergiovolador]

Once companies get a taste of no rights employment, I am afraid will be no going back.

If someone wants to make good money, it is probably time to create an agency that will help employers create bulletproof inside IR35 contracts and help with laying off permanent staff.

There is this saying, if you don't like something, embrace it.

[malvolio]

Once companies get a taste of no rights employment, I am afraid will be no going back.

Until a nother Susan turns up and sues their "employer" for all the accrued back pay...

If someone wants to make good money, it is probably time to create an agency that will help employers create bulletproof inside IR35 contracts and help with laying off permanent staff.

There is this saying, if you don't like something, embrace it.

But they all do that already, don't they? Oh, hang on...

Inside IR35 is easy. It's outside that causes the problems.

[elsergiovolador]

Such contractor can only take their own company to tribunal, as HMRC have said many times. They actually encouraged it if I recall for those who think they have no rights.

It is of course easy, but companies may not understand what clauses such contract needs to contain etc. so there is no chance for contractor to contest it and so that company wouldn't be accused of not taking reasonable care.

[malvolio]

Such contractor can only take their own company to tribunal, as HMRC have said many times. They actually encouraged it if I recall for those who think they have no rights.

It is of course easy, but companies may not understand what clauses such contract needs to contain etc. so there is no chance for contractor to contest it and so that company wouldn't be accused of not taking reasonable care.

What company? Do pay attention.

If you are being paid net of taxes by an intermediate brolly or agency and deemed to be inside IR35, the end client remains your "employer". YourCo almost certainly won't be allowed to participate.

And before you ask, the lost monies will cover bank holidays and other non-earning days (Christmas furlough, for example), SSP, training opportunities, maternity/paternity leave and no doubt a few less well defined others like HR support. You can also argue that minimum pensions contributions and holiday pay, when the permies are getting rather more that you are is also discriminatory.

[elsergiovolador]

What company? Do pay attention.

If you are being paid net of taxes by an intermediate brolly or agency and deemed to be inside IR35, the end client remains your "employer". YourCo almost certainly won't be allowed to participate.

And before you ask, the lost monies will cover bank holidays and other non-earning days (Christmas furlough, for example), SSP, training opportunities, maternity/paternity leave and no doubt a few less well defined others like HR support. You can also argue that minimum pensions contributions and holiday pay, when the permies are getting rather more that you are is also discriminatory.

You may be right for this scenario, but I was thinking for the case when contractor uses its own company for the inside contract. I am not sure the fee payer would be liable.

[malvolio]

You may be right for this scenario, but I was thinking for the case when contractor uses its own company for the inside contract. I am not sure the fee payer would be liable.

That's an edge case. There is zero point in using a Ltd Co for an inside gig under these new rules, in fact it wold be more of a liability trying to keep the accounting straight.

And if your situation does arise, potentially, then it's another reason not to use one...