Why the poor don't move

[shaunbhoy]

It's all very well saying get on your bike but just saying get on your bike doesn't work, and when this is allowed to happen on a grand scale, resulting in huge bills for the rest of us, then at some point you have to stop blaming individuals and hold the government to account for decades of taking the easy option and persisting with policies that clearly aren't working.....

Not to mention the huge rise in the numbers of fooking cyclists clogging up the fooking roads too!!

[MyUserName]

Not to mention the huge rise in the numbers of fooking cyclists clogging up the fooking roads too!!

That's just called a target rich environment

[ZARDOZ]

I thought this was "The unbearable sadness of the Welsh valleys"

The guy on the right is so poor he has to wear his Mum's top

[doodab]

Like the welfare state? It's a good example of how welfare helps keep the poor poor, not to mention depressed in more ways than one.

Well yes, exactly like the benefit and tax system that creates perverse incentives not to work while allowing anyone sufficiently wealthy to take a nice bus ride down pay **** all street. Or the disintegrated transport policy that makes it impossible for someone who doesn't have (or can't afford to run) a car to take a job miles away.

I'd say that an economy predicated on shipping bodies vast distances is deeply flawed and unsustainable. Perhaps the answer is to relocate people by force.

[ZARDOZ]

Short term, get on your bike is the solution. Long term there has to be more regional investment. The Germans export more in each year than the total of our national debt. They make things you see.

[bless 'em all]

Perhaps the answer is to relocate people by force.

Good idea - where are we going to send them?

The 'Vallys' are a weird place in more ways than one. The lower halves are within a relatively easy commute in to Newport/Cardiff but it seems there's very little uptake on this as an idea.

I've looked, out of curiosity, into the house prices up that way - within 20 miles of Cardiff you can pick up a 4 bed house - ready to move into, new kitchen, bathroom etc. for £60k or less. Something like that IN Cardiff - £250k in a less fashionable area.

Sod all work up there, unless you fancy putting the top biscuit on the lower half of a custard creme for £7.20 an hour. Lots of new cars though.

[original PM]

Good idea - where are we going to send them?

The 'Vallys' are a weird place in more ways than one. The lower halves are within a relatively easy commute in to Newport/Cardiff but it seems there's very little uptake on this as an idea.

I've looked, out of curiosity, into the house prices up that way - within 20 miles of Cardiff you can pick up a 4 bed house - ready to move into, new kitchen, bathroom etc. for £60k or less. Something like that IN Cardiff - £250k in a less fashionable area.

Sod all work up there, unless you fancy putting the top biscuit on the lower half of a custard creme for £7.20 an hour. Lots of new cars though.

Motability is a wonderful thing!

[Old Hack]

I look at this simplistically. I have bought children into this world, it’s my job to provide and protect them. If this means I have work 200-600-900-1500 miles from home, then that’s what I will do. What I will not do, is sit at home feeling sorry for myself under some vague notion that where I am is home, complain there is no work, and take benefits to live on the bread line, and show my kids that’s how life is lived.

That’s the long and the short of it for me.

[KentPhilip]

Long term there has to be more regional investment. The Germans export more in each year than the total of our national debt. They make things you see.

Who makes this investment - the government or the private sector?

Assuming it is the government, I wonder what would happen in this regard if the government didn't make that investment. Would the private sector choose to make the investment instead, and would the country be as successful, or more or less so?

[Mich the Tester]

I look at this simplistically. I have bought children into this world, it’s my job to provide and protect them. If this means I have work 200-600-900-1500 miles from home, then that’s what I will do. What I will not do, is sit at home feeling sorry for myself under some vague notion that where I am is home, complain there is no work, and take benefits to live on the bread line, and show my kids that’s how life is lived.

That’s the long and the short of it for me.

I agree, but you were probably brought up to think that way, and you'll bring your kids up to think that way. So was I, and although what you're describing is pretty standard to me and I take for granted that I have to go where the work is, it's an advantage because it seems many people haven't had the benefit of that kind of upbringing. So in your case, it's a virtuous circle where you travel and do anything to work, and your kids do the same, and their kids do the same, up to the point that the family is really pretty well off. My parents own a business and have built it up twice, based in different countries before it became a success, and having succesful people around you influences how you think. It seems that in some places, or some families, there's a downward spiral of nobody working or nobody moving to look for something better, and if someone does move to find something better, he doesn't come back to associate with those losers back home because the one thing succesful people fear is being with losers, as if they're afraid of being infected with loserdom. What's happening in the Welsh valleys and a few parts of the north and Scotland won't be solved very quickly; it'll need generations to recover.