Unsettling story

[suityou01]

This is a bit unsettling this, and its got me torn in my views.

My daughter went to visit a friend from her schooldays, they are both 35 now, and found her with puffy eyes and extremely agitated. The friend had obviously been crying.
The friends hubby is a taxi driver in Liverpool. Now taxi driving can be a bit risky, especially at night, so this guy carried a steak knife for protection, he reckoned that he could always claim it was for cutting up food.
A few weeks ago, he was pulled over by the police. He reckons he was sleeping in his car, the police accused him of trying to hide his face. They searched the car , found the knife and arrested him. There is a zero-tolerance policy of carrying knives in Liverpool.


So he is up in court and looking at three months. When he comes out there will be no job, no house, and judging by the puffy eyes, no wife either

So the wife can't wait 12 weeks for him to come out. He'll be out in 6 with good behaviour. I smell a rat.

[Mich the Tester]

So the wife can't wait 12 weeks for him to come out. He'll be out in 6 with good behaviour. I smell a rat.

Don't know about his wife, but a lot of people are basically living hand to mouth, and even 6 weeks lost income could cause them serious problems.

[d000hg]

It didn't say 'massive steak knife'. A steak knife isn't usually very big.

Sounds very harsh to me to give someone 3 months for this; fair enough to give a warning and maybe a fine, but if there's no evidence to suggest it's for anything other than self defence, it seems a bit over the top to send the guy to prison and basically fook up his life. Would be different if he wa carrying a big samurai sword or a sub machine gun, which could suggest more aggressive intent than self defence.

A knife isn't a defensive weapon. In fact a small knife is more worrying because it is less scary and more chance you'd have to use it. Pepper spray would be more effective - though is that legal either?

[Mich the Tester]

A knife isn't a defensive weapon. In fact a small knife is more worrying because it is less scary and more chance you'd have to use it. Pepper spray would be more effective - though is that legal either?

Fair enough; I just think this kind of story illustrates the vacuous nature of the phrase 'zero tolerance'. Some amount of tolerance is ALWAYS necessary when people live close together; some leeway from a judge or magistrate or indeed the police, understanding that someone feels a need to defend himself is essential for maintaining a civil state of affairs; that doesn't mean you let him off, perhaps he actually needs to be warned, fined and advised by the police as to how to defend himself in a legal manner; it seems to me that a prison sentence, assuming for now that EO's given us the facts correctly, is counterproductive; it messes up the guy's life unnecessarily and it's likely to make him, and those people who know him, less respectful of the police and the courts. It plays into the hands of populists who would say that the police are pestering the ´law abiding citizen´ instead of 'nicking villains'. Obviously, it´s not the court´s job to consider the political ramifications of their actions, but it IS the job of policy makers to think a bit further than the end of their own noses when dreaming up stuff like ´zero tolerance´, which sounds to me like one of those weaselling phrases that politicians use to try and sound tough and appease the underbelly of public opinion.

[PRC1964]

I'm pretty sure you you can get a prison sentence for having pepper spray too. This however claims to be legal.

[Mich the Tester]

Nope.

Nor is mace.

However, an aerosol of antiperspirant is probably as effective.

Especially this stuff; http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Axe_(grooming_product)

[thunderlizard]

this guy carried a steak knife for protection, he reckoned that he could always claim it was for cutting up food.

"What, officer? Surely you've seen us all lined up at the cab rank with our porcelain plates of filet mignon with wilted asparagus and a peach coulis on our laps?"

The police are trying to cut down on the knife-carrying culture and this is the kind of thing they have to do. When I'm being ferried around Scouseland, I'd rather not think that Robert de Niro in the driver's seat might be carrying a "shank". Under what circumstances would he decide to "defend himself"? If I looked like I was going to be sick on the seat? If I didn't have any cash smaller than a £20? If I disagreed about the Pakistanis ruining the area?

[EternalOptimist]

So the wife can't wait 12 weeks for him to come out. He'll be out in 6 with good behaviour. I smell a rat.

Well its true, we only get one half of the story. On the face of it, its a bit worrying that your life can be screwed for carrying something like that tucked away for self defence.

On the other hand, suity is right, the guy might have been using his cab as a cover for dealing drugs(which might explain why the police were so keen on watching a cab driver)

One other fact I forgot, the desk sergeant advised the arresting officers to let him off with a bollocking, they refused. So there may have been something else


Its still a bit unsettling to see the fallout though, on essentially innocent people

[suityou01]

Well its true, we only get one half of the story. On the face of it, its a bit worrying that your life can be screwed for carrying something like that tucked away for self defence.

On the other hand, suity is right, the guy might have been using his cab as a cover for dealing drugs(which might explain why the police were so keen on watching a cab driver)

One other fact I forgot, the desk sergeant advised the arresting officers to let him off with a bollocking, they refused. So there may have been something else


Its still a bit unsettling to see the fallout though, on essentially innocent people

And why is wifey so ready to jump ship

[SizeZero]

I think he'll lose his taxi license if he has a criminal record, so its not just 6-12 weeks. Don't live there anymore, but perhaps NACRO would be able to give them some advice if they're still going? What's his brief told him to do? And isn't the missus working (if so, mortgage company might take a reduced payment for a few months, especially as they know there is an income still)?