Climate Change

[Solidec]

Seriously, you have to be rather stupid to not realize that mass deforestation and mass undustrialisation will have a significant effect on the global ecology of the planet.

Anyone with half a brain cell knows that nature operates on a giant equillibrium. Changing something, ANYTHING, significantly will have an effect somewhere else. Causality etc.

The degree of that effect down to human habits and actions is the thing that's at dispute. I am sure not ALL of the recent global climatic changes are due to human behaviour, but it is naive to think we play no part in maintaining a natural balance (or perpetrating an unnatural imbalance) in this world through our action.

[DimPrawn]

Seriously, you have to be rather stupid to not realize that mass deforestation and mass undustrialisation will not have a significant effect on the global ecology of the planet.

Anyone with half a brain cell knows that nature operates on a giant equillibrium. Changing something, ANYTHING, significantly will have an effect somewhere else. Causality etc.

The degree of that effect down to human habits and actions is the thing that's at dispute. I am sure not ALL of the recent global climatic changes are due to human behaviour, but it is naive to think we play no part in maintaining a natural balance (or perpetrating an unnatural imbalance) in this world through our action.

For example, bio-fuels (the saviour of the C02 brigade) cause mass deforestation, high food prices and more starving people.

Idiotic Al-Gore Day After Tommorrow bulltulip is actually damaging the world.

[EternalOptimist]

Seriously, you have to be rather stupid to not realize that mass deforestation and mass undustrialisation will not have a significant effect on the global ecology of the planet.

Anyone with half a brain cell knows that nature operates on a giant equillibrium. Changing something, ANYTHING, significantly will have an effect somewhere else. Causality etc.

The degree of that effect down to human habits and actions is the thing that's at dispute. I am sure not ALL of the recent global climatic changes are due to human behaviour, but it is naive to think we play no part in maintaining a natural balance (or perpetrating an unnatural imbalance) in this world through our action.

The planet is a complex reactive system which tends towards stability. It's just that one cycle is longer than the human race will have on it.
we just are not that important

[Cyberman]

For example, bio-fuels (the saviour of the C02 brigade) cause mass deforestation, high food prices and more starving people.

Idiotic Al-Gore Day After Tommorrow bulltulip is actually damaging the world.

.. and after just a simple change of government in 1997 look what we have now !!!

[sunnysan]

Climate Change

The problem with climate change and global warming IMHO, is in order to prove that a complex system like climate is changing, it needs to have a consistent state or set of actions, which it possibly does but AFAIK no scientist has been able to define these variables enough to put into any model to prove definatively if the earth is getting warmer, and more specifically that mans actions are a contributing factor.

What it doesnt take a scientist to figure out is that we are polluting the earth and subsequently poisening ourselves and our children.

The issue for the CC/GW movement is that political crediblity is dependent on a theory which relies on a lot of unsubstantiated variables, thus can be easily discredited.

I feel that if the political will from CC/GW debate translates into cleaner air in cities, cleaner industrial processes and more global concern for local environmental issues I dont really care if it is happening or not.

[Solidec]

For example, bio-fuels (the saviour of the C02 brigade) cause mass deforestation, high food prices and more starving people.

Idiotic Al-Gore Day After Tommorrow bulltulip is actually damaging the world.

Totally agree about biofuels, the whole Palm Oil industry is wrecking this planet big time.

[TimberWolf]

The planet is a complex reactive system which tends towards stability. It's just that one cycle is longer than the human race will have on it.
we just are not that important

The composition of the atmosphere does have a huge effect on climate though, and life has changed the climate and the composition of the atmosphere significantly in the past.

[Solidec]

The planet is a complex reactive system which tends towards stability. It's just that one cycle is longer than the human race will have on it.
we just are not that important

Not in the long term, no. However, our short term actions are effecting our short term existence! (not to mention the existence of those poor wee beasties that don't put a paw out of line and respect MamaNature

[DimPrawn]

Why they don't call it Global Warming now.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worl...lunge-40C.html

Americans were today shivering as bitter arctic winds caused temperatures to plunge to record-breaking levels in many parts of the vast country.
There are even fears that crowds planning to watch Barack Obama’s presidential inauguration next week could suffer hypothermia and frostbite in sub-zero conditions.

This winter has been one of the toughest in decades with temperatures today reaching as low as -38C in large areas of the Midwest and -40C in the coldest place.

But Al Gore's hockey stick graph shows the climate getting warmer and warmer, and he talks of disease through mild winters and searing drought and heat in the summer?


PS. The latest "Climate Change" models show that if we increase our C02 emissions at current rate, the planet will be 0.6 deg c warmer in 50 years.

Hockey stick anyone?

[Solidec]

Thing I hate most is you can't just be an Environmentalist these days, if you have green thoughts, you are bundled into the CO2 brigagde.

I care less about CO2 and more about natural wildlife, loss of wildernesses and the accompanying drop in biodiversity that this planet has seen through PURELY human proliferation and parasitic ecological destruction.

Nothing wrong with wanting to control CO2 emissions however, nobody really knows if or when the CO2 linked with cimate will hit a Positive Feedback loop and then become irreversible.

May happen, may not, but its a chance I would rather not take, especially if it can be avoided and also bring other benefits like cleaner air, new technology, reduced reliance on fossil fuels etc.