We shall fight them on the beaches....

[ASB]

Knowing that these guys had already committed murder, would you want to be responsible for a decision that led to members of the fire service then also being shot.

That is a perfectly reasonable observation. It is entirely possible he took the decision as the lesser of two evils. Of course we don't and can't know his motivation.

If he had said "see if you can rescue them" and the fire service had said "no chance, they might still be shooting" then I would have no problem. It is simply the fact that he ordered the fire service not to attempt any sort of rescue that I object to.

Of course that's not a view you can agree with - but that is of course your right.

[The Lone Gunman]

That is a perfectly reasonable observation. It is entirely possible he took the decision as the lesser of two evils. Of course we don't and can't know his motivation.

If he had said "see if you can rescue them" and the fire service had said "no chance, they might still be shooting" then I would have no problem. It is simply the fact that he ordered the fire service not to attempt any sort of rescue that I object to.

Of course that's not a view you can agree with - but that is of course you're right.

As senior officer on deck it is his duty first to ensure the safety of his own men. If he could not be sure of their safety he is duty bound to hold them back. Considering the fire power available to the gang inside the building he made the right decision.
As I understand it those men could have given themselves up at any stage.

[Cyberman]

As senior officer on deck it is his duty first to ensure the safety of his own men. If he could not be sure of their safety he is duty bound to hold them back. Considering the fire power available to the gang inside the building he made the right decision.
As I understand it those men could have given themselves up at any stage.

The fire crew could also have ended up as hostages to enable the murderers' escape. On balance, Churchill made exactly the right decision.

[Bob Dalek]

Churchill's gassing thing: he advocated non-lethal gassing - akin to modern tear gas for hooligans, etc. Hardly the loveliest of his acts, but let's keep it in perspective.

[ASB]

Churchill's gassing thing: he advocated non-lethal gassing - akin to modern tear gas for hooligans, etc. Hardly the loveliest of his acts, but let's keep it in perspective.

Churchill was particularly keen on chemical weapons, though he didn't get his own way. In Iraq in the '20s (I don't think it was used) he was advocating the use of poisionous gas to spread terror. Hardly equivalent to tear gas.

In WW2 he (and Roosevelt) said they would drop mustard gas bombs on German cities (though that was only going to be in revenge if the Germans gassed the red army). We did get as far as sending the bombs but apparently they got sunk in a raid on Bari.

He also wanted to launch an Anthrax attack on Germany and there may have bee a trial on an uninhabited Scottish island to test delivery.

http://www.fpp.co.uk/bookchapters/WSC/gaswar.html

[Bob Dalek]

Churchill was particularly keen on chemical weapons, though he didn't get his own way. In Iraq in the '20s (I don't think it was used) he was advocating the use of poisionous gas to spread terror. Hardly equivalent to tear gas.

But non-lethal.

In WW2 he (and Roosevelt) said they would drop mustard gas bombs on German cities (though that was only going to be in revenge if the Germans gassed the red army). We did get as far as sending the bombs but apparently they got sunk in a raid on Bari.

And? F--k 'em: they started it and were busily exterminating millions.

He also wanted to launch an Anthrax attack on Germany and there may have bee a trial on an uninhabited Scottish island to test delivery.
Shame he didn't.

http://www.fpp.co.uk/bookchapters/WSC/gaswar.html

Leftie Student Union type, that's you.

[ASB]

Leftie Student Union type, that's you.

I think not you'll find. You're inferring that yourself.

I was merely pointing out that Churchill was quite prepared to order the wholesale slaughter of innocent civilians. His criteria for that was shortening the war by 1 year. This is somewhat different to "well it's just a bit like tear gas". I think the mortality rate of mustard gas is a few orders of magnitude higher.

There is a body of opinion that the only reason this didn't happen was because we couldn't make the chemical weapons quickly enough. He certainly moved from the idea of using chemical weapons in a retaliatory manner to using them in an offensive manner.

I think, given the times, it is likely this wouldn't have bothered many. It would probably have been viewed as a necessary evil.

Churchill was a brilliant wartime leader. He was quite prepared to make difficult decisions.

[Bob Dalek]

I think not you'll find. You're inferring that yourself.

I was merely pointing out that Churchill was quite prepared to order the wholesale slaughter of innocent civilians. His criteria for that was shortening the war by 1 year. This is somewhat different to "well it's just a bit like tear gas". I think the mortality rate of mustard gas is a few orders of magnitude higher.

There is a body of opinion that the only reason this didn't happen was because we couldn't make the chemical weapons quickly enough. He certainly moved from the idea of using chemical weapons in a retaliatory manner to using them in an offensive manner.

I think, given the times, it is likely this wouldn't have bothered many. It would probably have been viewed as a necessary evil.

Churchill was a brilliant wartime leader. He was quite prepared to make difficult decisions.

Leftie Student Union type, that's you.