Road pricing bill before Commons

[gingerjedi]

Have you noticed how Dang is selective with the bits he responds to...and his arguements are getting shorter and shorter.

I think he is 'Sam Tyler' from the hit TV show 'Life on Mars' as I don't see this utopia where everyone works in their towns of residence, buses are cheap and the only thing that’s ruining it all is a bunch of dirty cortina's tearing round and spewing out filth.

Wake up dang65 its all a dream!

[dang65]

Oh dear dang65, this blows you argument out of the water.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/waste/stor...148613,00.html

http://living.scotsman.com/index.cfm?id=719812004

Maybe train commuters should subsidise us car drivers with a bit of ‘carbon offsetting’ for all the damage you do.

Have you actually read those articles? The basic idea that a car is more "enviromentally friendly" than a train is based on a couple of major assumptions. The train has to be full (not uncommon for them to be at least rather crowded) and the cars also have to be full (er, fairly rare, verging on unheard of I would say). And the journey has to be a high speed intercity route.

Any urban journey (i.e. the vast majority of all journeys) completely reverses the result. To quote the article: "The professor is at pains to point out that the train is still far superior environmentally than other modes of transport over short distances."

But anyway, I'm not lecturing people about the environment. I'm just saying that by using your own personal vehicle to get you around everywhere you are causing congestion and noise and danger and damage to the roads. For that you have to pay. I have to pay too when I use my car. I'm not telling people not to use their cars, just to stop complaining about being made to pay for the privilege.

I don't know how many times I've said that now.

[BoredBloke]

In the town I live in, nobody I know works there except a mate of mine who is a nurse. Everybody in the nicer bits works outside Rochdale because all Rochdale offeres are sh1t jobs with sh1t pay. I would consider using public transport if it were viable. I have proved to Dang that my commute to a site on the other side of Manchester was NOT VIABLE. If I spend 8 hours in the office, I'm not going to spend half as long as that getting to and from the site. And that would be if everything ran to plan.

[wendigo100]

Oh no, I would have them strictly for car use only. Banned from them would be buses, trucks, builders vans, and cars with engine power of less than 150 bhp and more than 3 years old, (some derogations for well maintained Italian exotica need to be sorted etc.). They could knock down the railway stations and build multi-storey car parks in their place.

City-centre to city-centre motorways without jams!

Hmm. I see where you are coming from.

[dang65]

I would consider using public transport if it were viable. I have proved to Dang that my commute to a site on the other side of Manchester was NOT VIABLE. If I spend 8 hours in the office, I'm not going to spend half as long as that getting to and from the site.

All you've proved to me is that you can't be bothered with a long commute on public transport. You consider that not viable, I consider it viable. In fact, I do just that. It takes me just under two hours door to door, just over an hour of which is on the train - time I can use to read, write, study, mindlessly stare out the window at the rather pleasant Lancashire countryside, listen to music or the radio. When I drive I'm limited to the last two, and most the time I'm just concentrating on staying alive.

[wendigo100]

But anyway, I'm not lecturing people about the environment. I'm just saying that by using your own personal vehicle to get you around everywhere you are causing congestion and noise and danger and damage to the roads. For that you have to pay. I have to pay too when I use my car. I'm not telling people not to use their cars, just to stop complaining about being made to pay for the privilege.

I understand. Motorists already "pay for the privilege".

1. The motorist already pays more in road and fuel taxes than it has costed to maintain roads.

2. He already pays for congestion through wasted time and fuel.

3. Noise and danger is part of life, but overemphasized here. Busses and trains are also dangerous. So are kitchen knives, footballs and electrical appliances.

You support further charges which, as the motorist already covers all the nation's costs of motoring, must be intended as a punishment for using cars. So I ask myself:

1. What does he want to punish motorists for?

2. Does he realise that what he supports will affect the poorest most, who, in addition, are often those who have to travel furthest to find work?

[Ardesco]

But anyway, I'm not lecturing people about the environment. I'm just saying that by using your own personal vehicle to get you around everywhere you are causing congestion and noise and danger and damage to the roads. For that you have to pay. I have to pay too when I use my car. I'm not telling people not to use their cars, just to stop complaining about being made to pay for the privilege.

The point is we already pay for this via Road TAX, Tax on Fuel, Tax on the car parts that we replace regulary (e.g. tyres, brake pads), tax on private plates (well we are contractors!!) etc, etc.

WTF should we pay more?? We already pay more than enough to keep the roads in a decent state (which a lot of them aren't kept in anyway).

[BoredBloke]

"All you've proved to me is that you can't be bothered with a long commute on public transport. You consider that not viable, I consider it viable. In fact, I do just that. It takes me just under two hours door to door, just over an hour of which is on the train - time I can use to read, write, study, mindlessly stare out the window at the rather pleasant Lancashire countryside, listen to music or the radio. When I drive I'm limited to the last two, and most the time I'm just concentrating on staying alive."

OK straw poll folks - who would do the following

1 - walk half a mile to the bus stop
2 - bus into town
3 - 1 mile wal to train station
4 - train into city centre
5 - 1 mile walk in city centre
6 - bus/trian out to the site

the whole process would take 2 hours, which would be reversed to get home. This is also the best estimate - It's public transport so it is liable to delays and missed connections. You arrive stressed, probably sweaty and most probably late.

Or

1 - get into your car and get there dry and ontime 1 hour later.

[threaded]

During rush hour I'm faster on my bicycle than the train, bus or driving a car.

[BoredBloke]

"During rush hour I'm faster on my bicycle than the train, bus or driving a car."

It can't be downhill all the way there and back.