Do men have a right to "hit" on women?

[Willapp]

I don't think any man should assume anything from a woman from how she dresses.

This is not the 1950s.....

You've probably never used Tinder then... sometimes photos is all you get, so what are you supposed to infer from them. People need to accept that how you dress absolutely does affect how people view you. Whether it's a man in a smart suit for work, or a woman in a thong bikini, your clothing choices say plenty about you.

[Jog On]

Had heard of The Rules and The Game. I once read a book about dating written by a woman; her approach was for you to have a "stable" of dates to take out during your time dating, but the moment you slept with one of them that was it; you shut the door on the rest of your stable once you've picked your horse! The emphasis was very much about getting into the mindset of a woman and trying to think "why does a woman need me" - the answer being that if the woman does "need" you - there's something wrong and you should stay well away. They have to want to spend time with you and it's figuring out what makes them tick (could be a number of things) that will make them want to spend time and form a relationship with you.

However, I read this before the Social Media explosion, about 10 years ago when I was just coming out of college after being home schooled; still didn't really know how to approach / talk to girls/women very well. I think the mantra is still kind of the same, you have to know what they want in order to be a meaningful part of their lives... The issue comes when what they want is attention from multiple men via the internet in the form of suggestive comments and such. How are you supposed to form a trusting, deep relationship with someone who craves the attention of others?

Excellent question - I experienced this and put up with it and forgave it when I was a 'nice guy'. My approach was to be understanding and see beyond it and love the person underneath and 'not take it personally'. I thought if I was super-nice I'd have a great relationship. Ended up being treated like a doormat and cheated on.

I found out that I was just having my boundaries tested and the nicer I was the more I was pushed - a bit like a child with a new nanny or a schoolroom full of kids testing out a new teacher to see what they can get away with. I remember being sent on errands to go and fetch things and doing it...

It's a sad realization but it's why I now have no moral issue with being red pilled and telling feminists where to get off. For the record I was brought up by my mother and sister who drilled it into me from an early age that I had to be the perfect gentleman, be a 'lovely man' while they both slagged my dad off with a vengeance. I'm no misogynist, I love women and have my boundaries now - which is much better.

[Platypus]

You've probably never used Tinder then... sometimes photos is all you get, so what are you supposed to infer from them. People need to accept that how you dress absolutely does affect how people view you. Whether it's a man in a smart suit for work, or a woman in a thong bikini, your clothing choices say plenty about you.

I've used Tinder plenty. The time to establish what she's "up for" is when you start messaging, not when you look at the pictures.

[mattfx]

I've used Tinder plenty. The time to establish what she's "up for" is when you start messaging, not when you look at the pictures.

But it's double standards; any woman looking at pictures of a man will assume certain things by the way he dresses and his profile pictures:

Jeans and a shirt - probably fairly average bloke with reasonable fashion sense, but also possibly quite dull and conformative
Suit - business type, possibly plays too much golf and enjoys going to strip clubs with his business buddies
Some kind of action photo - Someone who is passionate about their hobby / sport
Night out only photos - Someone who is only after a few one nighters

There was an article about a woman who deliberately messaged a ton of guys with differing pictures and those were some of the categories she formed from talking to them. It was interesting. Yet the girls all pose in similar ways and take similarly scantily clad pics yet expect just as you say - you to establish what she's game for after mesasging. Sorry, you don't go to an interview dressed in Burkenstocks and khaki's and say "by the way, don't assume anything because I dressed like this, establish what i'm like from our conversation" - just no.

[mattfx]

Excellent question - I experienced this and put up with it and forgave it when I was a 'nice guy'. My approach was to be understanding and see beyond it and love the person underneath and 'not take it personally'. I thought if I was super-nice I'd have a great relationship. Ended up being treated like a doormat and cheated on.

I found out that I was just having my boundaries tested and the nicer I was the more I was pushed - a bit like a child with a new nanny or a schoolroom full of kids testing out a new teacher to see what they can get away with. I remember being sent on errands to go and fetch things and doing it...

It's a sad realization but it's why I now have no moral issue with being red pilled and telling feminists where to get off. For the record I was brought up by my mother and sister who drilled it into me from an early age that I had to be the perfect gentleman, be a 'lovely man' while they both slagged my dad off with a vengeance. I'm no misogynist, I love women and have my boundaries now - which is much better.

Man, I've had the exact same thing. As you say, it's just boundary testing! The Polish girl I was talking about had previously had 3 other long term relationships, all with abusive boyfriends of varying different natures. I actually think in some kind of messed up way, she needed someone with a firm hand because when she found someone nice who wasn't up for an argument, she didn't really know how to behave and just be normal. It was a bit like she lived off the drama!

My dad left when I was quite young too and had the same as you from Mum and sister.

[Willapp]

Yet the girls all pose in similar ways and take similarly scantily clad pics yet expect just as you say - you to establish what she's game for after mesasging. Sorry, you don't go to an interview dressed in Burkenstocks and khaki's and say "by the way, don't assume anything because I dressed like this, establish what i'm like from our conversation" - just no.

Exactly. Worse still, plenty of them want witty "banter" from the opening line, so if you go for something cheeky based on your interpretation of their photos, sometimes you get lucky but equally you can get shot down if it turns out their lingerie pics weren't a come-on.

For me the ideal Tinder profile has a decent face pic (so you can see if they're actually attractive), a full-length shot so you have some idea of figure, and the rest just establish what they like doing, be it feeding tigers in India (more common than you might think), water skiing or playing sports.

[darmstadt]

I've been reading the 'married red pill' stuff to make marriage great again (after 20 years) and it's working a treat. Glad I'm not on the dating scene - it sounds like a nightmare...

I always thought it was the 'little blue pill' that you used to get your marriage great again

[mattfx]

Exactly. Worse still, plenty of them want witty "banter" from the opening line, so if you go for something cheeky based on your interpretation of their photos, sometimes you get lucky but equally you can get shot down if it turns out their lingerie pics weren't a come-on.

For me the ideal Tinder profile has a decent face pic (so you can see if they're actually attractive), a full-length shot so you have some idea of figure, and the rest just establish what they like doing, be it feeding tigers in India (more common than you might think), water skiing or playing sports.

Don't even get me started on the "b" word. This is the exact reason I moved to Match when I was internet dating; the quality of woman is infinitely better there than Tinder, they are actually interested in something meaningful and most times, you don't find out a few weeks later they actually have a better half / husband lurking around. Long live paid for subscriptions for premium services.

[Jog On]

Exactly. Worse still, plenty of them want witty "banter" from the opening line, so if you go for something cheeky based on your interpretation of their photos, sometimes you get lucky but equally you can get shot down if it turns out their lingerie pics weren't a come-on.

For me the ideal Tinder profile has a decent face pic (so you can see if they're actually attractive), a full-length shot so you have some idea of figure, and the rest just establish what they like doing, be it feeding tigers in India (more common than you might think), water skiing or playing sports.

So glad I'm not doing the tinder thing, keep seeing screenshots posted on RP with lists of requirements like:

Must be 6'2" or taller
Must be no more than 12% body fat
Must earn at least $100k/year
No computer geeks!!!
Absolutely no computer games!!
Hanging out with guy friends will be limited and subject to approval
No female friends!!!

Bit harsh I think...

[mattfx]

So glad I'm not doing the tinder thing, keep seeing screenshots posted on RP with lists of requirements like:

Must be 6'2" or taller
Must be no more than 12% body fat
Must earn at least $100k/year
No computer geeks!!!
Absolutely no computer games!!
Hanging out with guy friends will be limited and subject to approval
No female friends!!!

Bit harsh I think...

Certainly wasn't that bad when I was using it 18 months or so ago. But I was pretty selective in my swiping and I think I lucked out with a badminton player, teacher and a much older lady who had some interesting stories!

12% body fat is insane. I was 16% once which is by no means amazing, and maintaining that was tough!