So why the productivity gap?

[VectraMan]

I don't really recognize this, at least with the people I know and have worked with. My guess is lots of things like short-term thinking, lack of investment in tech/research, poor education and unprofessional management.

It's a trend not an absolute. But maybe we are a bit too quick to make excuses, like short-term thinking, lack of investment, poor education and unprofessional management. Not that you're wrong, but all those things are easy to say. Bad managers are often quick to blame lack of resources for why a project is going off the rails (I'm sure we've all heard that) but if they're not getting the most out of the resources they do have then that's not really accurate. And the staff having been told it's not their fault are happy to take it easy too.

[woohoo]

It's a trend not an absolute. But maybe we are a bit too quick to make excuses, like short-term thinking, lack of investment, poor education and unprofessional management. Not that you're wrong, but all those things are easy to say. Bad managers are often quick to blame lack of resources for why a project is going off the rails (I'm sure we've all heard that) but if they're not getting the most out of the resources they do have then that's not really accurate. And the staff having been told it's not their fault are happy to take it easy too.

I'm against excuses, i think people should take responsibility for their actions. But when I studied management about 15 years ago there was evidence of in the case of Germany of managers being more professional and trained to manage.
As I said often encouraged to study for a second degree in a relevant subject. I don't see that so much here. I've actually seen accountants and sales people promoted to run technical teams, which I think is mad.

Anyway, as I said on a positive note I think we have huge amount going for us here in the UK. Lots of real talent (including management and running companies).

[BigRed]

While I don't disagree with what people are saying, productivity is normally measured on the shop floor, where it is easier to compare the cost of making widgets. Comparisons of more white collar work would focus on design and usability, a much more subjective assessment.

In my youth it was much the same story and the unions said they were working on antiquated machinery with more breakdowns and less automated production lines. Nissan established new factories with up to date machinery and proved the unions right. I started work as an engineering graduate in the Aerospace industry and about half the machines were pre war, which was looking a little old even in those days.

There has been a tradition in the UK of underinvestment in equipment and training. This applied in manufacturing but was also apparent in football where most managers had no qualifications compared to their European counterparts, which probably explains the plethora of foreign managers in the game today.

I've worked with Americans and found them to have a culture of long hours which naturally leads to chilling out at the watercooler because it isn't sustainable to be at the top of your game for extended hours, Indians that I've worked with tend to want to follow the script and don't like to raise their head above the parapet to offer any innovation (apart from one exceptional guy). Poles truly frightened me with their attention to detail and productivity combined with low wages. If the outsourcing movement had gone there first we would all be out of a job.

The above is all broad brush strokes of course and more about the average, after all, there must be some good merkins

Perhaps if my commute to Nottingham wasn't approaching 2 hours each way on a good day and 3 hrs if there are roadworks or an accident I would be more alert and productive once I actually got into the office. The distance would suggest 1hr 15min but the congestion is ridiculous.

[SussexSeagull]

I agree that most nationalities have their traits but I have never found one that is inherently more productive or hard working than another.

That said i have never worked with the Chinese.

[DodgyAgent]

It's because we're all posting crap on internet forums..

Except anyone who is the current "poster of the year"

[BigRed]

I agree that most nationalities have their traits but I have never found one that is inherently more productive or hard working than another.

That said i have never worked with the Chinese.

I agree entirely, the American system of long hours and Indian trait of following instructions and not taking initiative come from their society and upbringing not from their race, it isn't about the person, it's about their environment, there are always outliers but upbringing has a massive influence, for example, I was brought up in the Midlands in an industrial region and really struggle with the concept of working extra unpaid hours. When I was on the shop floor people would stand up and walk out of meetings when the hooters blew, no flexibility at all.

[SueEllen]

I agree entirely, the American system of long hours and Indian trait of following instructions and not taking initiative come from their society and upbringing not from their race, it isn't about the person, it's about their environment, there are always outliers but upbringing has a massive influence, for example, I was brought up in the Midlands in an industrial region and really struggle with the concept of working extra unpaid hours. When I was on the shop floor people would stand up and walk out of meetings when the hooters blew, no flexibility at all.

I've noticed that newer immigrants and young people, who don't already have an attitude, work hard in London. Then at some point the young people get p*ssed and stop putting the effort in.

I know in retail this is likely due to poor management who don't thank staff for working properly. I've actually been in shops where customers have asked management to thank staff and the manager just looked confused.