So much confusion

[jaffab]

Actually, on a serious note amongst all of this tomfoolery, think about how a Scotland break up from the UK could play out... and its not a pretty picture...

SO lets say the SNP get their way, there is another Scotish vote and this time they win. And lets suppose that the EU lets Scotland join the EU. And lets suppose that 'free movement' is still apart of the EU deal.

So now, all the people from the EU no longer want (or can get) to London. Instead, they head off to Edinburgh or Glasgow. After all, England would have much tighter boarder controls by then, and we wont let people in on the basis of "oh, we are off upto Scotland, honest gov" - so they will have to come in via one of the Scandinavian countries. They would still prefer to be in Scotland than say Poland or Turkey because I assume Scotland would have its new format of the SHS (NHS) and by EU law, they would have to treat all the people coming in free of charge. Same goes for housing, etc.

But then, how would England stop the Immigrants in Scotland just pouring down south to England? Would they even bother? Why would an immigrant leave scotland when Scotland has so much space, and the benifits they would not get in England. But England would have to have some controls in place.. having a border on the M6 is all fine, but there are plenty of fields to cross over so maybe some form of wall/fence would be built (rebuilt) after all, just in case?

Which means Scotland would turn into the new Greece.... Immigrant tent cities all over the place, a SHS which would drown, and a shortage of money. Would Scotland or the EU want that?

Which means that for that to work, the only way Scotland could join the EU is for the right of free movement/health care/etc to be removed. Which would be a shame, because when you boil it right down, its the only real reason why the UK voted to leave in the first place, which means if those parts are removed, the UK would be out of a system which was finally working (possibly)??

Feel free to knock me down on this.. just running the process through in my mind and in a conversation with my (Scottish) wife who is very unhappy of this prospect and what could become of her home land.

[scooterscot]

Turning up and accessing free benefits in countries does not make sense. .

I struggle to fathom people that believe immigration of EU citizens do so for our benefits. It's almost like they never bothered to check the facts.

1) The majority of migrants coming to the UK come from outside the EU. Usually 2nd generation indians from family already resident in the UK. Ergo the referendum result will change nothing about that.

2) The EU migrants coming to the UK are generally young people of working age who actually WORK for a living.

3) The same young people are usually fit and healthy and do not rely on the NHS as the media would have you believe.

[scooterscot]

Yeah - And if they did, they would not have a king... so what would they call themselves? United North? North Britain?
And what would the rest (assuming Wales didnt join them) call them/ourselves? We could still call it the United Kingdom.. but with Just England and Wales, the UK would no longer be anything, neither would the GB, so I guess we would just be Britain?

'The northern lights' or the 'The United Kingdom'?

The UK can hardly continue to call itself the UK with only Wales and England. That's just daft. And just Britain makes no sense either as it refers to the four nations.

You've really not thought this through have you?

[scooterscot]

I share it. So effectively the same as EU membership, but reduced influence. And the Brexiters think they've won?

ganz genau -

let them have their nostalgic moment

[scooterscot]

SO lets say the SNP get their way, there is another Scotish vote and this time they win. And lets suppose that the EU lets Scotland join the EU. And lets suppose that 'free movement' is still apart of the EU deal.


Feel free to knock me down on this.. just running the process through in my mind and in a conversation with my (Scottish) wife who is very unhappy of this prospect and what could become of her home land.

I accept your invitation.

How about Scotland holds an referendum before Westminster activates article 50? In that instance it technically it never left the EU.

Ball's in your court.

[jaffab]

I accept your invitation.

How about Scotland holds an referendum before Westminster activates article 50? In that instance it technically it never left the EU. The London's financial services move to Edinburgh. Still in the EU, still on the UK island.

Ball's in your court.

Yep, you are quite correct. On the basis that we could still be in the EU for the next 2 or 10 years with all the hoops to go through, this well may then be the case. And a lot of finance companies already have offices in scotland around the glasgow and stirling areas.

I would still imagine when the EU and the remaining parts of the uk finally leave, then scotland would still need (and i imagine want) to become its own fully fledged member rather than sitting in a pre UK shadow.

But, i still think freedom of movement will be a problem for scotland in the long run.

[Old Greg]

I accept your invitation.

How about Scotland holds an referendum before Westminster activates article 50? In that instance it technically it never left the EU.

Ball's in your court.

The problem is that Scotland is not a member of the EU. The UK is. If Scotland could arrange things so that it is the successor state as far as EU membership is concerned then it may have legs. The EU could acquiesce to make an example of the UK.

[scooterscot]

I'm going to play some piano. My head needs another subject.

[Old Greg]

I'm going to play some piano. My head needs another subject.

Ode to joy?

[scooterscot]

Ode to joy?

Snow patrol - chasing cars

Not quite at this level, not far off either.