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Petition to get the gov to reconsider the dividend tax changes

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    #51
    Originally posted by DimPrawn View Post
    YOU might do that. Go use an umbrella company or go permie. Tard.
    No, most people do that. People talk about "going contracting" and then deciding whether to go Ltd or brolly. Nobody talks about "starting a contracting business". The tiny minority of us who operate more like a traditional business are not representative of contractors and to suggest otherwise is either ignorance or narcissism.

    Originally posted by eek View Post
    We use them because the law was changed back in the 1970's in a way that meant the only way we could work was via a limited company.

    If you don't understand the history of this its best not to comment.

    The tax advantages or disadvantages are a sideline. We work this way because we aren't employees and don't really want to be employees.
    I'm aware of that and basically said as much:
    the fact is, a Ltd is just a convenience/necessity for contractors
    ...
    A Ltd is NOT the most sensible structure for a contractor, we use them because it's the most efficient way of working
    I never said anything here about tax advantages and have often described them in the past as a perk.
    Originally posted by MaryPoppins
    I'd still not breastfeed a nazi
    Originally posted by vetran
    Urine is quite nourishing

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      #52
      So are you an FLC fan, doog?

      Comment


        #53
        Originally posted by motoukenin View Post
        Cant believe the number of contractors I have spoken to that think the increase in dividend tax is negligible , on 100K dividend its another 6K
        If you're taking dividends of £100k a year, do you really think anyone is going to care that you're having to pay a bit more tax?

        Pick your battles, IR35 and expenses will have a far greater impact, are far less reasonable, and far easier to explain/argue than "I have to pay an additional £6k tax on my £100k+ earnings".

        Also, most contractors are not taking £100k out, even those who earn a lot, so your example isn't representative.
        Originally posted by MaryPoppins
        I'd still not breastfeed a nazi
        Originally posted by vetran
        Urine is quite nourishing

        Comment


          #54
          Originally posted by mudskipper View Post
          So are you an FLC fan, doog?
          In principle I like the idea of something along those lines, though I don't know the ins and outs of what is being proposed specifically and I would want the choice rather than be forced into it... also the ability to change from a FLC to a Ltd if I end up growing to something more substantial.
          Originally posted by MaryPoppins
          I'd still not breastfeed a nazi
          Originally posted by vetran
          Urine is quite nourishing

          Comment


            #55
            Originally posted by motoukenin View Post
            Cant believe the number of contractors I have spoken to that think the increase in dividend tax is negligible , on 100K dividend its another 6K , approx 30% increase in taxes paid and that's without all of the other things we will be dealing with like increased NI , tax on expenses , etc. etc. thinking of working abroad for a few months and then coming back here to live off the profits and then repeat.
            It's even worse on a £500K dividend.

            No one in the real world gives a tulip. Those buying their 70" flat screen telly from Bright House, whilst doing the weekly shop on a credit card and funding the shortfall with Wonga aren't really going to cry buckets about it and us.

            Petition is pathetic. You may as well start one about what a rip-off main dealer Porsche servicing costs are.

            Better if each director wrote a letter to their MP and then voted the little **** out at the next election.

            Comment


              #56
              Originally posted by motoukenin View Post
              Cant believe the number of contractors I have spoken to that think the increase in dividend tax is negligible , on 100K dividend its another 6K , approx 30% increase in taxes paid and that's without all of the other things we will be dealing with like increased NI , tax on expenses , etc. etc. thinking of working abroad for a few months and then coming back here to live off the profits and then repeat.
              Offset it against the Corporation Tax improvements and it's not significant. If you have to now get Tesco Value Caviar tough tulip.
              The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was convincing the world that he didn't exist

              Comment


                #57
                Originally posted by motoukenin View Post
                Cant believe the number of contractors I have spoken to that think the increase in dividend tax is negligible , on 100K dividend its another 6K , approx 30% increase in taxes paid and that's without all of the other things we will be dealing with like increased NI , tax on expenses , etc. etc. thinking of working abroad for a few months and then coming back here to live off the profits and then repeat.
                I'd guess it's because -
                Most Contractors don't pay out 100K dividends
                Most(?) Contractors don't object to the principle of paying taxes for public services
                Most(?) Contractors understand that the dividend tax is a tax on the income they choose to take from their company, and although the increase means they will be paying more tax, they are still better off than most permie.

                Actually, maybe that's just me.

                The changes to expenses concern me more. In effect these punish me personally for my company doing business, whereas both employers and employees of large companies are not affected.
                Some examples, over the past couple of years I've had:
                6 months of weekly travel from Hampshire to Edinburgh - flights, accomodation and subsistence claims.
                3 months of 60 mile round trip daily commute - mileage and subsistence claims.
                3 months of 150 mile round trip daily commute - mileage, subsistence and occasional accomodation (where I've had to be available early morning the next day) claims.

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                  #58
                  The problem I see with this change is it discourages investment by small business owners in their businesses.

                  In my own particular circumstances I run a small LTD company ( it's just me ) selling a software product that I wrote and a subscription to a "SAAS" version of my product ( that I also wrote with help ).

                  My SAAS product is new and I have committed at least £30k of the money that I earned from selling my original software product to it this year. It has started to gain some traction and is bringing in some revenue each month but has not recouped the original investment to date. I plan to commit at least another 30k to it next year.

                  That 30k I could have just put in my pocket but instead I spent it with a variety of local suppliers. This is classic business investment and very much done "At Risk".

                  I take a standard salary/dividend mix to pay for my living expenses ( wife, 4 kids, etc ).

                  The current arrangement lowers my tax bill. It allows me to invest in the company whilst still providing adequately for my family.

                  Next year my tax bill goes up. This is not something that I object to in itself. If Osborne gets the deficit down and the countries finances straight then that is something I would support. Otherwise my kids will be paying it off in 30 years time.

                  The fact is that next year I will have less disposable income. So something has to give. Either my family gets less OR my suppliers get less.

                  As a rule I put my family first. So my suppliers will be taking the hit.

                  The main supplier to take the hit is the local business centre as I was planning on moving into an office there. They'll get less income, which means they'll have less profit and therefore pay less tax.

                  And this is why the change is dumb. Not because it's "unfair" but because it puts the breaks on small companies expanding. It is small companies growing today that create the large companies of tomorrow, creating the high-skilled jobs and stable tax-base that the country needs.

                  Comment


                    #59
                    Originally posted by tomtomagain View Post
                    The problem I see with this change is it discourages investment by small business owners in their businesses.

                    In my own particular circumstances I run a small LTD company ( it's just me ) selling a software product that I wrote and a subscription to a "SAAS" version of my product ( that I also wrote with help ).

                    My SAAS product is new and I have committed at least £30k of the money that I earned from selling my original software product to it this year. It has started to gain some traction and is bringing in some revenue each month but has not recouped the original investment to date. I plan to commit at least another 30k to it next year.

                    That 30k I could have just put in my pocket but instead I spent it with a variety of local suppliers. This is classic business investment and very much done "At Risk".

                    I take a standard salary/dividend mix to pay for my living expenses ( wife, 4 kids, etc ).

                    The current arrangement lowers my tax bill. It allows me to invest in the company whilst still providing adequately for my family.

                    Next year my tax bill goes up. This is not something that I object to in itself. If Osborne gets the deficit down and the countries finances straight then that is something I would support. Otherwise my kids will be paying it off in 30 years time.

                    The fact is that next year I will have less disposable income. So something has to give. Either my family gets less OR my suppliers get less.

                    As a rule I put my family first. So my suppliers will be taking the hit.

                    The main supplier to take the hit is the local business centre as I was planning on moving into an office there. They'll get less income, which means they'll have less profit and therefore pay less tax.

                    And this is why the change is dumb. Not because it's "unfair" but because it puts the breaks on small companies expanding. It is small companies growing today that create the large companies of tomorrow, creating the high-skilled jobs and stable tax-base that the country needs.
                    I'm in a similar position to you. I sell and rent software as a service. I have spent years part time developing this and now I'm fulltime on it. Suddenly I'm not a proper business anymore and I have to pay more tax that my bigger competitors don't.

                    I am going to keep the money in the company, and not pay dividends and cut outgoings to the bone. **** the govt and **** the economy. If it takes off and becomes successful, I will take the business and myself offshore somewhere and ensure UK gov gets **** all of the proceeds.

                    Tories are the govt of small business.....s

                    Comment


                      #60
                      Originally posted by DimPrawn View Post
                      Petition is pathetic. You may as well start one about what a rip-off main dealer Porsche servicing costs are.

                      Better if each director wrote a letter to their MP
                      For once we're in agreement on something. Voting on a petition is the equivalent of a FaceBook like.
                      Originally posted by MaryPoppins
                      I'd still not breastfeed a nazi
                      Originally posted by vetran
                      Urine is quite nourishing

                      Comment

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