Religion

[MyUserName]

Then there are the Catholics who believe that babies who die before being baptised will spend eternity in purgatory. Nice people.

Do they stay babies or do they grown up wondering where everyone is?

[GlenW]

Do they stay babies or do they grown up wondering where everyone is?

Knowing what Catholic priests are like they probably age just enough for them to be sexually abused by passing clergy.

[Gibbon]

Could you just point me at the biblical source that teaches that?

Athanasian Creed
Which underpins most western liturgy.

part of it can be found as an "Authorized Affirmation of Faith" in the recent (2000) Common Worship liturgy of the Church of England [Main Volume page 145

Whosoever will be saved, before all things it is necessary that he hold the catholic faith. Which faith except every one do keep whole and undefiled; without doubt he shall perish everlastingly. And the catholic faith is this: That we worship one God in Trinity, and Trinity in Unity; Neither confounding the Persons; nor dividing the Essence. For there is one Person of the Father; another of the Son; and another of the Holy Ghost. But the Godhead of the Father, of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost, is all one; the Glory equal, the Majesty coeternal. Such as the Father is; such is the Son; and such is the Holy Ghost. The Father uncreated; the Son uncreated; and the Holy Ghost uncreated. The Father unlimited; the Son unlimited; and the Holy Ghost unlimited. The Father eternal; the Son eternal; and the Holy Ghost eternal. And yet they are not three eternals; but one eternal. As also there are not three uncreated; nor three infinites, but one uncreated; and one infinite. So likewise the Father is Almighty; the Son Almighty; and the Holy Ghost Almighty. And yet they are not three Almighties; but one Almighty. So the Father is God; the Son is God; and the Holy Ghost is God. And yet they are not three Gods; but one God. So likewise the Father is Lord; the Son Lord; and the Holy Ghost Lord. And yet not three Lords; but one Lord. For like as we are compelled by the Christian verity; to acknowledge every Person by himself to be God and Lord; So are we forbidden by the catholic religion; to say, There are three Gods, or three Lords. The Father is made of none; neither created, nor begotten. The Son is of the Father alone; not made, nor created; but begotten. The Holy Ghost is of the Father and of the Son; neither made, nor created, nor begotten; but proceeding. So there is one Father, not three Fathers; one Son, not three Sons; one Holy Ghost, not three Holy Ghosts. And in this Trinity none is before, or after another; none is greater, or less than another. But the whole three Persons are coeternal, and coequal. So that in all things, as aforesaid; the Unity in Trinity, and the Trinity in Unity, is to be worshipped. He therefore that will be saved, let him thus think of the Trinity.

Furthermore it is necessary to everlasting salvation; that he also believe faithfully the Incarnation of our Lord Jesus Christ. For the right Faith is, that we believe and confess; that our Lord Jesus Christ, the Son of God, is God and Man; God, of the Essence of the Father; begotten before the worlds; and Man, of the Essence of his Mother, born in the world. Perfect God; and perfect Man, of a reasonable soul and human flesh subsisting. Equal to the Father, as touching his Godhead; and inferior to the Father as touching his Manhood. Who although he is God and Man; yet he is not two, but one Christ. One; not by conversion of the Godhead into flesh; but by assumption of the Manhood by God. One altogether; not by confusion of Essence; but by unity of Person. For as the reasonable soul and flesh is one man; so God and Man is one Christ; Who suffered for our salvation; descended into hell; rose again the third day from the dead. He ascended into heaven, he sitteth on the right hand of the God the Father Almighty, from whence he will come to judge the living[16] and the dead. At whose coming all men will rise again with their bodies; And shall give account for their own works. And they that have done good shall go into life everlasting; and they that have done evil, into everlasting fire. This is the catholic faith; which except a man believe truly and firmly, he cannot be saved.

HTH to dispel any doubts.

[meridian]

<Godwins Law>

Presuming Hitler recanted before shooting himself, he'll be in Heaven then.

That Jewish Anne Frank though, she'll be burning for eternity.

<\Godwins Law>

[Gibbon]

Judgement, Heaven and Hell

Are not Christian concepts, they had to borrow them from the pagans to flesh out their empty philosophy.

Virgil, Aeneid Book 6 will enlighten you.

Dante's Inferno was based on this, Virgil was his guide.

[RasputinDude]

HTH to dispel any doubts.

Which were not biblical references. Don't get me wrong, I accept that there is lots of 'Church creed' about hell, but remarkably little in the bible and of that remarkably little which came from Jesus himself.

(Which is why I call myself a follower of the way of Jesus rather than a 'Christian')

[MyUserName]

Which were not biblical references. Don't get me wrong, I accept that there is lots of 'Church creed' about hell, but remarkably little in the bible and of that remarkably little which came from Jesus himself.

(Which is why I call myself a follower of the way of Jesus rather than a 'Christian')

Jesus spoke about hell in the gospel of Luke and said this:

22 “The time came when the beggar died and the angels carried him to Abraham’s side. The rich man also died and was buried. 23 In Hades, where he was in torment, he looked up and saw Abraham far away, with Lazarus by his side. 24 So he called to him, ‘Father Abraham, have pity on me and send Lazarus to dip the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue, because I am in agony in this fire.’

25 “But Abraham replied, ‘Son, remember that in your lifetime you received your good things, while Lazarus received bad things, but now he is comforted here and you are in agony. 26 And besides all this, between us and you a great chasm has been set in place, so that those who want to go from here to you cannot, nor can anyone cross over from there to us.’

So hell is a place of agonising torment and there is no way out, according to Jesus?

[RasputinDude]

That is a parable - a story - an invention using hyperbole to explain an idea.

[GlenW]

That is a parable - a story - an invention using hyperbole to explain an idea.

And what is the rest of the New Testament?

[MyUserName]

That is a parable - a story - an invention using hyperbole to explain an idea.

Which matches closely with this statement:

Mark 9:43 - And if thy hand offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter into life maimed, than having two hands to go into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:

and this one:

Matthew 13:50 - And shal cast them into the furnace of fire: there shall be wailing, and gnashing of teeth.

and this one:

Revelation 21:8 - But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death

The image of people burning for eternity in hell seems consistently applied through the bible (many verses other than the ones above) and Jesus always seems to talk about it in terms of physical torture. Why would you disbelieve it?