Attitude to being available out of hours

[istvan]

Premium rate 09xx services can range from £0.10/min up to £1.50/min. Get one of those numbers and select the £1.50/min. I do not know how much a telco keeps, but you make money while the client is on the phone. This is about £90/hour for the client, so keep pretending you just woke up and have no idea who is calling during the first minutes, than ask tons of questions and clarifications, so about 15 minutes in the call you may start talking about the topic that they called with. Be a nitpicker and go into every bit of detail that you might think of and hopefully a question like "can you send me a usual report tomorrow", will turn into a £45 deal. Darn, why don't they offer higher minute rates.

I never tried it, so do not blame me...

[psychocandy]

I'm sorry, but I didn't go contracting in order to have someone feel able to demand something that's not mentioned in the contract, and then blame me and my character for not providing it.

Yeh. But they still do. Unfortunately a lot of clients want you to be exactly like a permie....

I even had one client many years ago asked me if I could do on call like the rest of the team. I said OK fair enough lets speak to agency and sort out contract which they were fine with.

They offered me same on call rate as permies (£25 a night or something crap). Best thing was if I got called I got paid my hourly rate but only when I was in the office. If I got called and sort on the phone - zero. If I drove in an hour, spend 30 mins sorting, then drove home another hour I'd get 1/2 hourly rate. (two and half hours of my time, £15 worth of petrol, £5 or whatever it was bridge toll, £20approx+VAT charged LOL).

Umm let me think - no thanks. Didnt go down well for some reason....Not quite sure what they expected me to say.

[psychocandy]

Premium rate 09xx services can range from £0.10/min up to £1.50/min. Get one of those numbers and select the £1.50/min. I do not know how much a telco keeps, but you make money while the client is on the phone. This is about £90/hour for the client, so keep pretending you just woke up and have no idea who is calling during the first minutes, than ask tons of questions and clarifications, so about 15 minutes in the call you may start talking about the topic that they called with. Be a nitpicker and go into every bit of detail that you might think of and hopefully a question like "can you send me a usual report tomorrow", will turn into a £45 deal. Darn, why don't they offer higher minute rates.

I never tried it, so do not blame me...

Istvan - sounds like you have experience of 'making your client last a bit longer' LOL. You should take this up professionally maybe. :-)

[BolshieBastard]

If the client presumes that some free work will be available, perhaps he should put that in the contract!

Or the client knows he has to pay for it, just like the rest of the services.

[Willapp]

Surely the trick here is to establish the boundaries of what is acceptable very early on in the contract. It's never happened to me (yet...) but if I started getting out of hours calls from a client, after the second or third call I would be sitting down with them and explaining that out of hours support isn't part of the contract and would need to be factored into the rate blah blah etc.

For those clients who baulk at the idea of paying extra for this, they clearly don't understand (or don't want to) the contractor model and then you have to make a decision to either support their lack of understanding (by doing it for free) or take a stand. Yes you risk not getting a renewal but who wants to work for a client who doesn't even remotely understand or respect the business model of contracting.

I do think there is room for give and take though, and I wouldn't be so quick to put the brakes on it if the client was generally reasonable, for example allowing the time to be taken in lieu.

[The Spartan]

The alternative is the loss of the contract as the client may claim one is not a team player

I'm a contractor not a team player

[The Spartan]

I wouldn't be so quick to put the brakes on it if the client was generally reasonable, for example allowing the time to be taken in lieu.

Forgive if I'm wrong and I'm sure someone will correct me if I am but that last part sounds like a permiedoom thing

[Ignis Fatuus]

Yeh. But they still do. Unfortunately a lot of clients want you to be exactly like a permie.

....

For those clients who baulk at the idea of paying extra for this, they clearly don't understand (or don't want to) the contractor model and then you have to make a decision to either support their lack of understanding (by doing it for free) or take a stand. Yes you risk not getting a renewal but ...

you're not a permie. Some clients will fail to understand that and make it impossible to continue happily in the contract. Tough. Walk away.
If you can't walk away from (sh)it, what is contracting for?

I do think there is room for give and take though, and I wouldn't be so quick to put the brakes on it if the client was generally reasonable, for example allowing the time to be taken in lieu.

Forgive if I'm wrong and I'm sure someone will correct me if I am but that last part sounds like a permiedoom thing

If you ask for time off in lieu, that's a permiedom thing. If you as Director of YourCo give your employee (you) time off in lieu for the work that he (you) provided to YourCo, and YourCo's client remains OK about how YourCo fulfils its contract, that's a business thing.

[The Spartan]

If you ask for time off in lieu, that's a permiedom thing. If you as Director of YourCo give your employee (you) time off in lieu for the work that he (you) provided to YourCo, and YourCo's client remains OK about how YourCo fulfils its contract, that's a business thing.

Thanks for clearing that one up

[SueEllen]

Surely the trick here is to establish the boundaries of what is acceptable very early on in the contract. It's never happened to me (yet...) but if I started getting out of hours calls from a client, after the second or third call I would be sitting down with them and explaining that out of hours support isn't part of the contract and would need to be factored into the rate blah blah etc.

I would either:
1. Not pick up my mobile phone to them, or
2. Pick it up and tell them I'm in the middle of doing something like looking after children, taking a shower etc and tell them to call back in the working day.

I only ever give clients' my mobile phone number. They never have a reason to have my house phone number.

For those clients who baulk at the idea of paying extra for this, they clearly don't understand (or don't want to) the contractor model and then you have to make a decision to either support their lack of understanding (by doing it for free) or take a stand. Yes you risk not getting a renewal but who wants to work for a client who doesn't even remotely understand or respect the business model of contracting.

It's better not to be renewed.

You always have a risk - however small of an IR35 investigation - and you don't want them finding one contract with a client like that.

I do think there is room for give and take though, and I wouldn't be so quick to put the brakes on it if the client was generally reasonable, for example allowing the time to be taken in lieu.

Reasonable clients do things from the beginning that let you know they are reasonable, and they would never suggest you do an on-call/important roll out without ensuring you are adequately compensated first.