contract advice please

[stek]

The contract does state that 'if the Company cannot perform you will not receive a fee' - I would have thought that if you then operate as a Company you would be within your rights to send another musician in your place

I assumed 'Company' in this context was a Production Company ie - the cast/performers....

Oh, our arty-friends!

[LisaContractorUmbrella]

I assumed 'Company' in this context was a Production Company ie - the cast/performers....

Oh, our arty-friends!

Doh! Think you are right there Stek

[Wanderer]

There is a musicians' union, but I was too tight to update my membership, hence why I'm writing to this forum for advice!

Don't expect any good advice from us! My recommendation would be to join your union - they will carry a lot more clout on your behalf than you will ever do as a single person.

As for them offering you work which may or may not eventuate, it's a business decision for you to decide if you want to work on those terms. Most of us are IT contractors and we have it written into our contracts that we may not be offered work on any particular day but that's to work around the IR35 rules as much as anything and we tend to do much longer assignments so it's less of a risk.

As for the self employed question, are you trading as a LTD company or sole trader? If you want to determine your employment status then have a look at HMRC's Business Entity Tests. From what you say about your working practices, it sounds like you are self employed. If you can send a substitute without restriction (put in deps as you put it) then you are leaning towards being outside IR35. If you actually DO subcontract all or part of the work out for a particular engagement then you are a slam dunk for being self employed (eg, outside IR35).

[neilsolaris]

Hi,

Thanks again. I'm a self-employed person, I'm not trading as a limited company. However, for the purposes of this production I have to power to delegate as much as I want. I know for other shows, musicians are usually required to work for a certain percentage (often 70%) but that's not the case here.

My plan is, whenever I'm offered any other work, is to accept other work and get a dep in. The disadvantage from their point of view with this arrangement is that the standard of the music is going to suffer badly, but that's their problem I suppose! Sometimes the best way to learn is from mistakes, so I'm doing them a favour in the long run!

[kingcook]

My plan is, whenever I'm offered any other work, is to accept other work and get a dep in. The disadvantage from their point of view with this arrangement is that the standard of the music is going to suffer badly, but that's their problem I suppose!

And the disadvantage from your POV is that your business will suffer because you're palming off 5hit musicians to your clients.

[Taita]

Hi,

Thanks again. I'm a self-employed person, I'm not trading as a limited company. However, for the purposes of this production I have to power to delegate as much as I want. I know for other shows, musicians are usually required to work for a certain percentage (often 70%) but that's not the case here.

My plan is, whenever I'm offered any other work, is to accept other work and get a dep in. The disadvantage from their point of view with this arrangement is that the standard of the music is going to suffer badly, but that's their problem I suppose! Sometimes the best way to learn is from mistakes, so I'm doing them a favour in the long run!

I think most of the advice offered here relates to self-employed people as defined by the Employment Agency Acts and Regulations. A trace of ancient memory tells me that a musician is an 'entertainer' and therefore not covered by this legislation.

I may be totally mistaken about this as the memory is very ancient and things change..... however, I would suggest contacting ACAS (who are experts on employment laws) 08457 47 47 47 or HMRC. You do not need to identify yourself to gather information!

[neilsolaris]

Thanks Taita, great advice, I'll look into that.

The musicians I'll be hiring are highly skilled, but they won't have had the advantage of rehearsing, and practicing as I will have, so it won't be nearly as good. If it were better paid, then the deps would be willing to sit in on the show a couple of times to get to know it. It won't reflect badly on me, in fact people will probably think I'm a much better musician than any of the alternatives!

[Taita]

Thanks Taita, great advice, I'll look into that.

The musicians I'll be hiring are highly skilled, but they won't have had the advantage of rehearsing, and practicing as I will have, so it won't be nearly as good. If it were better paid, then the deps would be willing to sit in on the show a couple of times to get to know it. It won't reflect badly on me, in fact people will probably think I'm a much better musician than any of the alternatives!

As a worker I sympathise but as a show goer I may have an altogether different view!