Securing your contract work (when being asked what you want)

[DiscoStu]

I'd missed those ones - I'm enjoying trawling through them now. I think they should be added to BrilloPad's list of great CUK threads....

The RC windup is particularly amusing!

[TheFaQQer]

Finished the first one - now onto the "open book".

FWIW, I'm with TykeMerc:

Utter cobblers, you either have no clue or are a troll I can't decide.

The guy's clearly a total moron or an insane troll.

[shanti]

Correct. Even if you have a notice period of 100 days on their side and 100 days (or 1 day, or anything in between), they can get rid of you at any stage. You are paid for the work that you do - if you do no work (because they tell you not to come in during the notice period), then you get £0. Notice periods from the client are worse than worthless.

This is not really correct is it? Contractors can be served notice and be asked to leave (normal practice), but the Clientco is still obliged to pay for the outstanding weeks or days that is stated in the contract (or maybe they technically are not obliged? - but they do as normal practice)

What is worthless is contract end dates. Being bluffed off with a contract date in Feb 2010 with a 1 day notice period is a waste of time. You can be killed whenever with 1 day notice.

Handing in notice and departure puts a stake in the ground to get things sorted out or your done, within a limited time, else it just drags on. And frankly, in most employment situations are your are not missed or your contribution gauged as required until walking out the door.

I guess my question is, other than goodwill - is there is way of securing the work, and the penalty clause is the only way - but then it seems as though it is highly unlikely to be signed.

[TheFaQQer]

This is not really correct is it?

Yes it is. I wouldn't have said it was correct if it wasn't.

Contractors can be served notice and be asked to leave (normal practice)

Indeed they can. Or they can be told to get out with no notice because of an instant termination clause in the contract.

, but the Clientco is still obliged to pay for the outstanding weeks or days that is stated in the contract

No, they aren't.

(or maybe they technically are not obliged? - but they do as normal practice)

Maybe (and I suspect that this is the case), you have had your contracts terminated more frequently than I. In my experience of "normal practice", if they are giving you notice, you either work the notice and get paid, or you don't work the notice and don't get paid. If clients understood contract law better, then the norm (as it should be) would be that you get nothing.

What is worthless is contract end dates.

Yes.

Being bluffed off with a contract date in Feb 2010 with a 1 day notice period is a waste of time. You can be killed whenever with 1 day notice.

Almost. You can be killed whenever, with 0 days notice.

Handing in notice and departure puts a stake in the ground to get things sorted out or your done

you're

, within a limited time, else it just drags on. And frankly, in most employment situations are your are not missed or your contribution gauged as required until walking out the door.

You are not employed by the client. Or actually, you seem to be.

I guess my question is, other than goodwill - is there is way of securing the work

Not sure where goodwill comes into this, at all. The easiest way of securing the work (and I suggest you consider this carefully, as it would appear to be your best option) is to become and employee of the client. You are an employee in all but name. You want to be an employee. Become an employee.

and the penalty clause is the only way - but then it seems as though it is highly unlikely to be signed.

You never know until you try. Since you have no contractual relationship with the agency or the client, then you are free to negotiate with them to get the clause. Failing that, you can find a different agency to work through, and get them to put the clause in the contract - there are plenty of decent agencies out there that I'm sure would be all too happy to do this. Hays, for example, spring to mind as one that might be worth trying.

[Clippy]

Oh shanti, given the amount of grief you seem intent on causing yourself, do you really think this contracting thing is for you...?

Thanks for saving me the bother of writing this.

Oh, and my reply to the original posters question can be found here.

[shanti]

You never know until you try. Since you have no contractual relationship with the agency or the client, then you are free to negotiate with them to get the clause. Failing that, you can find a different agency to work through, and get them to put the clause in the contract - there are plenty of decent agencies out there that I'm sure would be all too happy to do this. Hays, for example, spring to mind as one that might be worth trying.

Thanks for your replies - appreciate the insights.

True - the relationship has been severed within the 1 day notice. But, I can't go over the head of the agency to the consulting company - or even to the Clientco - due to restriction convents within the contract (emm...maybe worth checking the exact wording - just to be sure).

The client has not been told yet - and is setting up meetings to on Monday morning and expecting me to rock in and get on with things as normal - just have a feeling sh*t is going to hit the fan - perhaps then is the time to negotiate.

The consultancy company has left the door open to come back with what I want.. I guess I need to be sure about what I ask for, ensure it is meaningful, enforceable, reasonable - hence asking for ideas. Its hard to understand where the real line is when negotiating - and thus wondering how to gauge this.

If the poop really gets sprayed on Monday and the Clientco demand to get this sorted, I might get the opportunity to set my terms - the penalty clauses etc.. suggested would be the way to go, I guess.

[downsouth]

put up, shut or get the $$$$ out, you've obviously done something to instigate this issue. Forget it you've handed your notice in, not exactly a strong position is it!!!! V hard these days to hold anyone to ransom when your relying on others (agencies/consultancies) to keep you in work.

By all means have a go at getting the agency to accept 'your terms' but expect to be be out of work (bit like you appear to be at the mo).

[shanti]

put up, shut or get the $$$$ out, you've obviously done something to instigate this issue. Forget it you've handed your notice in, not exactly a strong position is it!!!! V hard these days to hold anyone to ransom when your relying on others (agencies/consultancies) to 7keep you in work.

By all means have a go at getting the agency to accept 'your terms' but expect to be be out of work (bit like you appear to be at the mo).

Thanks for the contribution.

The purpose of the boards is to request assistance and provide others with insights to what can and cannot be done. My question has been answered by a previous poster who has indicated that contractually there is a way to secure the work (IR35 issues included), but the agreement is unlikely to get signed.

Contractors, agents and Clientco relationships are based on negotiations and frequently these means gauging your leverage versus a agent/clientco (most ClientCo's want their lb of flesh and for the contractor to exit as quickly as possible). When people are prepared to stay irrespective of how they are being treated - it provides the opportunity to be exploited.

If you don't get what you want - you keep walking out the door. Trick is to ensure what you are asking is fair and a win/win - that's where I welcome the past experiences of others.

[shanti]

Oh shanti, given the amount of grief you seem intent on causing yourself, do you really think this contracting thing is for you...?

I got what I wanted prior to signing.. because it was reasonable and I asked.

[northernladuk]

I guess my question is, other than goodwill - is there is way of securing the work,

You are not getting this are you. I have seen your question answered in great detail at least 3 times.

From what I read of the other two threads goodwill isn't your strong point either

If you are going to go ahead and attempt to write a penalty clause against the client in to your next contract after handing in your notice for what appears to be no reason then good luck with that... really...