QDOS IR35 insurance

[malvolio]

Just because you tick the boxes, do you think that is always enough to see off HMRC without a fight?

If you are facing an investigation, no matter how right you are, it's going to cost you money to get rid of HMRC unless they just walk away from an S660 case these days.

They don't have a lot of choice. Providing the shares carry equal voting rights, you and your spouse can split your shareholding any way you like and there ain't damn all HMRC can do about it.

@Gaz_M - that does actually answer your question. It's not the proportion of shares that matters, only that they are equal in their right to being paid - i.e. of the same class - and hold equal voting rights, the point being that you are sharing the company and must therefore have an equal say in it. There's no point forcing an equal split if it means one spouse is pushed unnecessarily into the higher rate taxes. Also it only works for married couples or completely unrelated people. If it's only you and the other half that have shares, you don't need to worry about S660a at all.

[Gaz_M]

They don't have a lot of choice. Providing the shares carry equal voting rights, you and your spouse can split your shareholding any way you like and there ain't damn all HMRC can do about it.

@Gaz_M - that does actually answer your question. It's not the proportion of shares that matters, only that they are equal in their right to being paid - i.e. of the same class - and hold equal voting rights, the point being that you are sharing the company and must therefore have an equal say in it. There's no point forcing an equal split if it means one spouse is pushed unnecessarily into the higher rate taxes. Also it only works for married couples or completely unrelated people. If it's only you and the other half that have shares, you don't need to worry about S660a at all.

It's just me and my wife who have shares. Does that mean I don't have to worry about s660a? I'm confused

[malvolio]

It's just me and my wife who have shares. Does that mean I don't have to worry about s660a? I'm confused

Basically yes, if all you've done is issue the same type of shares to both of you, like 99% of us do, so that when you declare a dividend you pay both out at the same time, which 99% of us do. S660a can only apply to married couple if you've done something clever, like give the other half a different class of shares meaning you can pay dividends separately for each class, possibly at different rates. Which 99% of us don't.

It cost £1m to prove the point that S660a doesn't apply to married couples. Stop worrying about it. Or keep worrying, join IPSE to get full support for any taxation challenges from HMRC and then stop worrying

[Zero Liability]

So is the upshot of this whole thread that a) IR35 insurance (alternatively, PCG membership), b) TLC insurance and c) contract reviews are or are not expenses which you can save CT on?

[TheFaQQer]

So is the upshot of this whole thread that a) IR35 insurance (alternatively, PCG membership), b) TLC insurance and c) contract reviews are or are not expenses which you can save CT on?

PCG membership isn't an alternative to IR35 insurance. If you are only worried about IR35, then you would be best off to ditch the PCG membership and just take TLC35 which will fight your case and cover your costs completely. PCG will not do this, unless you buy an add-on with AbbeyTax. Qdos start at £360 a year, Abbey Tax start at £325 a contract.

As far as expenses go, I have always charged the PCG membership and TLC35 insurance as an expense to the company. You can't get tax relief on the PCG membership. Qdos used to do three contract reviews a year for free with TLC35, so I have never paid for a contract review.

[Batcher]

PCG membership isn't an alternative to IR35 insurance. If you are only worried about IR35, then you would be best off to ditch the PCG membership and just take TLC35 which will fight your case and cover your costs completely. PCG will not do this, unless you buy an add-on with AbbeyTax. Qdos start at £360 a year, Abbey Tax start at £325 a contract.

That wasn't my experience

As far as expenses go, I have always charged the PCG membership and TLC35 insurance as an expense to the company. You can't get tax relief on the PCG membership. Qdos used to do three contract reviews a year for free with TLC35, so I have never paid for a contract review.

+1 to these being expenses.

[Zero Liability]

I'm not currently a PCG member, but I have the Qdos policy (not the TLC one though at present, might get it when closing the company down though) and have had a contract review from Accountax before. I had thought that the PCG membership is not tax deductible, but I would assume from the above that the contract reviews and IR35 insurance proper are.

[malvolio]

I'm not currently a PCG member, but I have the Qdos policy (not the TLC one though at present, might get it when closing the company down though) and have had a contract review from Accountax before. I had thought that the PCG membership is not tax deductible, but I would assume from the above that the contract reviews and IR35 insurance proper are.

Just to be clear, PCG membership is a valid business expense like anything else that you wouldn't have if you didn't have the company, so no BIK applies, but because of a fairly arcane bit of case law to do with professional bodies it's not deductible against CT (although I rather hope the lost £50 a year won't bankrupt anyone!).

I totally fail to see the logic of getting insurance when closing the company though.

[Scruff]

Just got a £20 Amazon voucher from QDOS for a referral. Bonus.

[Zero Liability]

Just to be clear, PCG membership is a valid business expense like anything else that you wouldn't have if you didn't have the company, so no BIK applies, but because of a fairly arcane bit of case law to do with professional bodies it's not deductible against CT (although I rather hope the lost £50 a year won't bankrupt anyone!).

I totally fail to see the logic of getting insurance when closing the company though.

Well I've seen it recommended on here and by some accountants/IR35 consultants to cover the period until the company is struck off, in case the closure sparks an IR35 inquiry, however slim a chance that may be.