BN66 - Round 2 (Court of Appeal)

[nuffsaid]

Received this tip off concerning a Wealth Management (WM) company with clients affected by s58.

Of the Big 4 accountants, we now have 3 lined up against HMRC:

HMRC PwC
HMRC KPMG
HMRC Ernst & Young

You do have to wonder if Deloitte are also preparing to join too.
I'd be suprised if they don't have any affected clients.

[elpinar]

My missus asked me last night "what would happen if we lost the CTD cetificate, or if we had a fire?".
I told her that the certificate itself does not hold the value, so we're okay.

But I must admit, it's playing on my mind now. So can someone confirm this?

its a very good quaestion - think i will be bringing mine with me tomorrow to the office and giving a few key people (parents etc) photocopies of them just in case .... and scan them so that i have a soft copy

[DonkeyRhubarb]

You do have to wonder if Deloitte are also preparing to join too.
I'd be suprised if they don't have any affected clients.

It's probably more a case of who isn't involved.

HMRC let the scheme go unchallenged for 7 years so what the f**k did they expect.

Serves 'em right that they are now facing legal challenges from all directions.

[smalldog]

It's probably more a case of who isn't involved.

HMRC let the scheme go unchallenged for 7 years so what the f**k did they expect.

Serves 'em right that they are now facing legal challenges from all directions.

and it wont end there, some pretty rich individuals will be lining up behind the accounting firms. Reminds me of a scene in Airplane where people are queuing up with different weapons to beat up a lady passenger, but in our case the passenger is HMRC...

[Doug1965]

what the f**k did they expect.

They expected us to roll over and pay up so that they can give the money to the poor dear pensioners they've apparently been overtaxing.

[anxious1]

Totally biscuit!

They expected us to roll over and pay up so that they can give the money to the poor dear pensioners they've apparently been overtaxing.

I for one am gonna be very careful checking my tax when I'm a pensioner, which I probably will be before this lot is sorted out. However, given the current trends towards tax law desperation, retrospection & poorly defined laws for HMRC to interpret as they see fit, by then I may well be residing at HMs pleasure for not paying rusk tax in 1962.

[SantaClaus]

They expected us to roll over and pay up so that they can give the money to the poor dear pensioners they've apparently been overtaxing.

Nurses, Doug. Nurses!

[Slobbo]

How are costs awarded in court. We lost the JR so our side had to pay HMRC's costs right. If there are 4 cases running and one of them manages to get this overturned then what happens with the costs of the other cases. Does HMRC have to pay the costs for all 4 cases or just the one that it lost. One would assume that the other 3 would no longer need to continue.

I don't know how much these court cases cost but I am assuming it will be many millions.

It would be nice to know that if the HMRC have to pay costs of all 4 cases. That would hit them bad. (Unfortunately though ends up costing us). Would be even nicer if the idiot in the HMRC that thought this joke up was held accountable.

[BolshieBastard]

It's probably more a case of who isn't involved.

HMRC let the scheme go unchallenged for 7 years so what the f**k did they expect.

Serves 'em right that they are now facing legal challenges from all directions.

Is right.

Frankly, them leaving it 7 or 8 years is imo, compounding the issue beyond reasonable expectations but is nothing short of gross incompetent.

[BolshieBastard]

It would be nice to know that if the HMRC have to pay costs of all 4 cases. That would hit them bad. (Unfortunately though ends up costing us). Would be even nicer if the idiot in the HMRC that thought this joke up was held accountable.

Sadly, even if they lose they wont have to pay costs. It will still be taxpayers who will fund this.

What should happen is similar to benefit adjudication decisions in that the adjudication officer is wholly responsible for their decision ie if their decision is corrupt etc, they can be made quite literally to pay.

The hmrc officials who dithered for 8 years and made the situation a total mess really should be made accountable for their actions ie imprisonment, fines and work sanctions.

Sackings would be nice for a start.