self employeed thru a ltd co

[nicole]

hello,

can somone advice me how can i be considered self employeed from a legal point of view but trade thru a ltd co?

many thanks

[BolshieBastard]

'your' ltd co is its own legal entity. You are a director of the ltd co but you are also its employee.

[Paddy]

You can't be self employed and only have one client ie: your own limited company.

[ASB]

You can't be self employed and only have one client ie: your own limited company.

You can. It's a way of trading used by a number of people. Whether there is any point is different but there may be certain advantages in the expenses regimes. There is nothing to stop "your co" getting a contract and equally subcontracting this to "you t/a you computer services". Obviously the contract between you individually and your co needs to be drawn up carefully. Also in the event of an IR35 enquiry things can get interesting. But it is doable.

[mase]

Self-employed confusion

Nicole,

If I understand correctly, your situation is:
- you are a Romanian/Bulgarian national, therefore you are subject to temporary restrictions on being employed in the UK - UKBA
- you'd like to start working as an IT contractor, therefore you would need to form a ltd company
- as a RO/BG citizen, you are told by the UKBA that you can only work in the UK as self-employed. Therefore you're considering registering as self-employed, because you think that's your only legal option, but on the other hand you know that you need to work through a ltd, as most contractors here do.

The confusion I think you're making is between:
- 1. SELF EMPLOYED as sole-trader - a light-weight form of starting your own business in the UK (HMRC - Register as self employed)
- 2. SELF EMPLOYED as defined by EU Treaty - according to the same HMRC: Right to reside in the UK:

HMRC:

A self-employed person means a person who establishes himself in order to pursue activity as a self-employed person in accordance with Article 43 of the Treaty establishing the European Community.

European Community Treaty, Article 43 (google "article 43 ec"):

Freedom of establishment shall include the right to take up and pursue activities as self employed persons and to set up and manage undertakings, in particular companies or firms within the meaning of the second paragraph of Article 48, under the conditions laid down for its own nationals by the law of the country where such establishment is effected, subject to the provisions of the Chapter relating to capital.

So, the way I see it, you are self-employed (as defined by EU Treaty) if you set up your own limited company OR if you register as a self-employed person (sole trader). By contracting through your own limited company, you are self-employed as seen by EU legislation (therefore you have the right to be a contractor in the UK), but you are not self-employed in the sole trader sense (so you don't need to register as self-employed).

This is just my opinion, so please feel free to challenge it - by all means I am interested in hearing different opinions on the matter. Also, I'd like to know who to ask in order to get an official position on this: UKBA, HO, HMRC?

[brobi]

hello,

can somone advice me how can i be considered self employeed from a legal point of view but trade thru a ltd co?

many thanks

Does non-domicle come into it anyone? Or is it that EU rubbish that fowls this up?

[Crossroads]

You can. It's a way of trading used by a number of people. Whether there is any point is different but there may be certain advantages in the expenses regimes. There is nothing to stop "your co" getting a contract and equally subcontracting this to "you t/a you computer services". Obviously the contract between you individually and your co needs to be drawn up carefully. Also in the event of an IR35 enquiry things can get interesting. But it is doable.

ASB, could you elaborate on the points in bold?

I'm about to form a recruitment company (yup, I'm going to be EvenMoreDodgyAgent)...more of a sideline than anything, but hopefully with a handful of regular contracts - but potentially I could end up fulfilling some of the roles myself, would there be any benefit of a setup that saw me as director, shareholder, employee of "EMDA Ltd", and a self employed subcontractor for specific contract roles...?