Mandatory Holidays

[BA to the Stars]

Can you decide on the dates that you want or can you just leave the contract 5 weeks early?

[Platypus]

Hi All,

My end client is insisting all contractors take a mandatory 5 weeks holiday as a cost saving exercise. I have no issue with this as I like holidays

However, the paper I have been given to sign to agree to this is an amendment to a tri-partie contract betweem my ltd company, the agency and the end-client. I refused to sign the tri-partie contract when I started as my IR35 insurers said it was a bad thing IR35-wise. I said I have a contract with the agency which I have signed and I wasn't prepared to sign a three way one, the issue went away.

This time the agency is telling me this is a take it or leave it situation and I must sign or leave. The problem is I haven't signed the original contract in the first place so signing an amendment is a bit weird. Ignoring that if I do sign what are the IR35 implications of a three way contract? What are the IR35 implications of a mandatory leave period?

I have sought professional advice (am awaiting reply) but I respect the posters on this forum so thought I would see what people think. I am thinking the best solution is to get an 'appropriate' ammendment to my agency contract and sign that. But I am not sure I will be able to get out of this three way agreement this time round.

As an aside the end client is a global investment bank. They sold the news as "at least we are not giving you a 10% contract rate cut or terminating your contract which is what our competitors are doing". Seems like the bad times are returning ....

Cheers,
Lewis

If it's a separate piece of paper, why not just sign it and forget it? The chances of if ever coming to light are close to (if not exactly) zero.

[chris79]

I think some people take IR35 too seriously. If the client is requesting that you do -not- work for a specified time, then as a business you should be able to accommodate their wishes in the interest of keeping business with them?.. like the previous poster, the chances of it ever coming to light are pretty much nil. Just say that YOU dictated to them you would not be working these weeks if anyone ever asks.

[Integrity]

Recently I hired sales, marketing and graphic design expertise for my business. We agreed what was required moving forward, and the work was completed in stages. During one key part of the project, it was necessary to suspend the work for a period of time. The individual pieces of work that were in progress were completed, and work that hadn't started was suspended for a couple of months.

This is business, and the way business works. The client is the one paying they bill, they get to chose what they pay for. If they don't want your services during a 5 week period, don't provide them. However you choose to look at it, "He you pays the piper choses the tune!", and that will always be the case.

Your responsibilty is to decide how services will be provided. If someone in a restaurant wants egg and chips for breakfast, they want egg and chips, and they want it for breakfast. Arguing about what they eat, and when the eat it is not your concern, just as how you cook chips and eggs is your business.

Perhaps the mature option from your business perspective is to write a formal letter confirming that services to be provided by your business will be suspended as discussed until an agreed time in the future when services will resume.

As for the 3 party contract, I don't really have any comments, other than to ask if the client will actually sign the contract, or are they just named in it?

Integrity

[moorfield]

As I have a slight concern about how this is might be worded in renewed contracts here, I was idly chatting this morning to another contractor here (not Lucinda, sadly, but a good approximation) who has just renewed, about her new contract terms.

"Oh I don't really know, I didn't bother looking".

So the conversation moved on to more general matters such as IR35, Arctic Systems etc.

"Oh I don't really know, what's IR35?". (I am not joking).

[Lewis]

Thanks for all the replies. I think I'm going to insist I get the new clause (correctly worded) added as an amendment to the agency contract I have already signed.

[Mustang]

My own take on this is a couple of points:

1) Your contract is with the agency. The agency have a contract with the end client. If the end client wants to do this then the agency would need to sign a form with the end client and the agency would have to sign an amendment and negotiate it with you/YourCo

2) What they are effectively saying is "I want you to do X amount of work in 47 weeks for Y pounds" rather than "x amount of work in 52 weeks for Y pounds". If that is the case, I would rather have a new contract spelling that out rather than some underhanded method like this.

In my opinion, the end result is the same, but this is a more business like approach.

[Lewis]

As I have a slight concern about how this is might be worded in renewed contracts here, I was idly chatting this morning to another contractor here (not Lucinda, sadly, but a good approximation) who has just renewed, about her new contract terms.

"Oh I don't really know, I didn't bother looking".

So the conversation moved on to more general matters such as IR35, Arctic Systems etc.

"Oh I don't really know, what's IR35?". (I am not joking).

I am continually coming accross seasoned contractors who know all about IR35 yet don't have any cover in place for defence costs. I find that just as strange.

[Mustang]

yet don't have any cover in place for defence costs.

Or who only focus on the contract T's&C's and act in a manner that takes them inside IR35!!

[chris79]

Or who only focus on the contract T's&C's and act in a manner that takes them inside IR35!!

Ts&Cs - incorrect use of '.