BN66 - Time to fight back!!!

[simondolan]

Worth it?

Just out of interest, for those who used to use the schemes, even if you do end up winning, would all the hassle and stress be worth the tax "saved"?

[Likely]

Just out of interest, for those who used to use the schemes, even if you do end up winning, would all the hassle and stress be worth the tax "saved"?

Some people tolerate more risk than others.

[smalldog]

and really dont expect Montp to comment in any way shape or form how they intend to fight this...

PS - how many people who think this scheme was injust also consider people who avoid IR35 to be tax avoiders and therefore cheats (in theor opinion)?

After all thats a tax that quite a few people on this board who are scatching of Montp probably have avoided paying....

wondered if we have a bit of double standards going on here....

[DonkeyRhubarb]

Just out of interest, for those who used to use the schemes, even if you do end up winning, would all the hassle and stress be worth the tax "saved"?

I've asked myself this question and, with the benefit of hindsight, probably "No". I wasn't put under investigation while I was in the scheme, so in my case the "hassle and stress" didn't start until after I'd already left.

If I was starting over then I would choose a totally risk-free way of avoiding tax, namely paying as much as I could into a pension.

However, hindsight is a wonderful thing. Operating through a Ltd Co may be considered a low-risk option now but it didn't seem that way 7 years ago when IR35 first came in.

[Lewis]

However, hindsight is a wonderful thing. Operating through a Ltd Co may be considered a low-risk option now but it didn't seem that way 7 years ago when IR35 first came in.

I'll second that! There were no insurances around then and very mixed advice. I followed the risk-adverse advice of the time which was to up my salary to a pretty large amount (maybe not quite full IR35) and wait to see what happens. In hindsight I unnecessarily paid a lot of PAYE+NI. I know people who just went full IR35 and they lost more. Other risk takers just stayed on the £5K salary and are laughing now. I think if you don't lose much more than IR35 as a result of this it's not the worst choice you could have made at the time. I had some schemes sold to me back then and they had counsel's opinion and seemed attractive but I just thought I'd wait it out a while. Then I ended up going MSC instead. Out of interest, what kind of bills are you guys being sent by HMRC? Same as IR35 caught or significantly more?

[smalldog]

for me I didnt really have any choice. It was etiher pay more than your average joe in tax due to employers and employees NI which I wasnt about to do, continue to run the Ltd company and basically evade tax (which seemed riskier to me as at the time nobody knew how IR35 would pan out) or take a punt with one of these schemes or take a crap paid perm job....weighing everything up I would have stayed Ltd company route as the IR35 rules seem to be pretty lazily enforced....but again, hindsight and all that...Its easy for someone knewish to contracting to say you should have stayed IR35 avoidance by doing this or that or the other BUT if you were contracting at the time it was introduced, it was considered pretty much the end of the contracting industry hence all these schemes popping up and hence so many people using them.

To be honest if the schemes hadnt been introduced Im not sure the contracting industry would have been able to sustain itself and the knock on to corps and non profit making would have been very damaging. Imagine all those projects that wouldnt have happened due to no short term staff availability....and then imagine what it would have done to the actual companies bottom lines.....

[smalldog]

Lewis, they might be laughing now but I wonder how they would feel about the prospect of a retrospective IR35 tax bill? Do u think they would be so damming of us or maybe they would consider it unfair themselves...?

[DonkeyRhubarb]

Out of interest, what kind of bills are you guys being sent by HMRC? Same as IR35 caught or significantly more?

Slightly more than "IR35 caught".

If it wasn't for the interest penalties, then it would be better than "IR35 caught". Unfortunately, the interest rate they charge is significantly higher than you can get in a savings account, so the difference racks up over the years.

I wish I'd known about CTDs 7 years ago. Although, if I'd known it was going to drag on for so long perhaps I'd have done something a bit more creative with the money.

[Lewis]

Out of interest, what kind of bills are you guys being sent by HMRC? Same as IR35 caught or significantly more?

Slightly more than "IR35 caught".

If it wasn't for the interest penalties, then it would be better than "IR35 caught". Unfortunately, the interest rate they charge is significantly higher than you can get in a savings account, so the difference racks up over the years.

I wish I'd known about CTDs 7 years ago. Although, if I'd known it was going to drag on for so long perhaps I'd have done something a bit more creative with the money.

Well if you ask me, if after all of this you only work out a bit worse off than IR35 caught, I don't think that's bad at all. Obviously not nice for you guys, I appreciate, but at least it's not bankruptcy! In fact still better than going permie.

[smalldog]

trouble is a lot of people wont have stashed away lots of cash just in case hector comes knocking. Would HMRC really bankrupt people, I suspect not, more likely they will agree on a repayment plan....