Nubie and IR35

[Bertie]

Was pretty sure my contract was outside IR35 after reading the excellent info on these forums.

Asked my new accountant to have a quick look, just in case, specifically at the clauses below. They reckon its inside IR35 and will give me the full reasons if I pay their fee for a full contract review.

Any thoughts before I pays me money ?

Thanks

5. The Supplier acknowledges that the Assignment will be provided by the Contractor using one
or a number of Individuals named in the Assignment Summary ("Individuals"). Nothing in these
terms shall give rise to the presumption that the Individuals are employees of the Supplier or
the Client. The parties expressly agree that this is a contract for Services.
6. The Contractor shall be entitled to provide a replacement for the Individual(s) but any such
replacement shall only take place provided that the proposed replacement has the necessary
qualifications, skills and experience and is suitable to perform Services for the Client and
the Client is satisfied and has confirmed their acceptance of such a replacement in writing.
7. Services are to be provided during the periods detailed in the Assignment Summary and any
Services provided outside these periods for the Client must have the prior authorisation of the
Client.
8. The Services shall be provided at the location(s) specified in the Assignment Summary
("Location(s)"). In the event the Client and the Contractor agree the Services are to be
provided at the Contractor’s own premises, the Contractor shall ensure adequate provision of
office and communication facilities at their own expense, including but not limited to,
telephone, computer and electronic mail/internet access. Any equipment not provided by the
Client must be adequately insured by the Contractor.
Fees Expenses and Payments

[MrsGoof]

Get a pro. to look at the contract, they will also negotiate the wording to help you.

It'll cost a few quid but the cost compared to the extra NI is negligible.

Bauer an Cotterel (?sp) seem to be popular around here.

BTW. If you get investigated then it's not your contract that will be looked at but your working practices !

[Bertie]

Thanks

I'm pretty sure I'll go for a proper review but still interested what the folks on here say.

The working practices bit ..

I'll be 200 miles away from home, stayin in B&B and flyin home at weekends

Does that help ?

[Back In Business]

No, working practises have to do with how you and your client treat each other when you are on site. If they can hire/fire, tell you what to wear and when to be in the office, then you are probably caught by IR35.

[oraclesmith]

My thoughts are that an accountant may not be the best person to perform a contract review.

It seems OK to me, but for a few sops to the client which give them a little control over replacements and where you can work. Agreement though, as a concept, is generally a two-way street in my opinion doesn't imply one party has control over another.

I think clause 6 may be the real problem. The last bit about needing the clients confirmation in writing could, in practise, tie the contractor to the client because they may not want anyone else even if they're more skilled. It does give you an opportunity to provide a subby though.

You need professional help - go see B&C, not your accountant.

[kingshuk]

I too am about to start contracting for the first time.

The sections you have copied look quite similar (in places identical!) to the one I have. I am in a similar dilemma and finally sent it to Bauer and Cottrell yesterday (http://www.bauerandcottrell.co.uk/) for review.

The real problem is - if they say that the contract is within IR35 I don't think I am in a position to make them change the contract right now.

[Bertie]

Thanks all for your suggestions and comments

I'm on my way to the B&C site now

As with kingshuk its too late to change anything now - you live and learn !

[Sockpuppet]

No, working practises have to do with how you and your client treat each other when you are on site. If they can hire/fire, tell you what to wear and when to be in the office, then you are probably caught by IR35.

Those all have to be taken with a pinch of salt.

I.e what to wear. I wear a suit at work. No one has told me to its just accepted business attire.

When to be in the office. Again no-one tells me what time to be there but as I am the project manager starting at 8pm when everyone else is on 9-5 is a bit daft!

[Back In Business]

Those all have to be taken with a pinch of salt.

I.e what to wear. I wear a suit at work. No one has told me to its just accepted business attire.

When to be in the office. Again no-one tells me what time to be there but as I am the project manager starting at 8pm when everyone else is on 9-5 is a bit daft!

That's what I was getting at (approximately ). If the director(s) of YourCo decide on your dress code and working hours then you are not under client control in those areas.

[Bertie]

Could anyone hazard a guess of what percentage of IT contractors are currently working outside IR35 ?

It seems to me (yes, I know I'm new to this) that it could take both expert manovering and a splash of luck to get both your contract spot on and your working practices in line with being outside IR35.