Reply to: The Times on Saturday 12th May

[MayMadness]

It’s tough to see whether the article is positive or not for the agency ‘ID Medical’ on one hand they are being proactive and emailing their workers to ask them to get in touch for advice IF they are using loan schemes however as someone who works in their market I can’t help thinking that they should know who is and who isn’t. They are supposed to check and audit the umbrella companies that the workers want to use before making any payment to them.

The article from my perspective is not positive overall. But this group (the health sectors) has not been really accessed and warned. So highlighting their plight is a start. I would recommend anyone with knowledge, proof or just legal knowledge to write and request editorial changes or further investigation.

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/static/contact-us/

The media is writing up presuming that people are fully away of the entire situation when they first got involved. That is really unfair from a social and psychological perspective. It is lazy and opinionated to deem people greedy without understanding the context from which they were dealing with. More importantly the schemes have not been deemed illegal by the court from my understanding. I am now in contact with a small handful of people that are scared to death because they do not know if they were involved. These people are not IT and they are scared to contact HMRC and do not know where to turn to find out. They didn't understand what was being asked but because it was insisted upon to take the job or they assumed the appropriate tax was taken out based on their situation. Corporations and trusts get tax breaks. They, like many of you, joined the schemes under the assurance it was legal.

This negativity that the media is perpetuating must be challenged. To do that we need stories of how you heard and were sold these things in the context of how one was feeling. Excited to start something new? Confused? How many of us are well versed in tax law as employees let alone contractors? This human factor and psychological angle needs to be represented accurately rather than lazy journalism.

1. Info regarding EBT type schemes prior to 1999 (if they existed and anyone kept that info if EBT did exist) is going to be gold nuggets. Especially if we can find out who was involved with them.

2. Anyone willing to correspond, please get in touch.

[Togoodtobetrue]

More exposure on the news for the Health Sector

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/h...-tax-kdtbdfrg8

It’s tough to see whether the article is positive or not for the agency ‘ID Medical’ on one hand they are being proactive and emailing their workers to ask them to get in touch for advice IF they are using loan schemes however as someone who works in their market I can’t help thinking that they should know who is and who isn’t. They are supposed to check and audit the umbrella companies that the workers want to use before making any payment to them.

[MayMadness]

More exposure on the news for the Health Sector

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/h...-tax-kdtbdfrg8

[phil@pmtc]

Does anyone think missold umbrellas could be the next ppi style compensation industry?

I suppose the umbrella / schemes will have most likely pheonixed but some of the largest recruitment companies in the world pushed these schemes for back handers.

There's already a few places offering legal assistance on the mis-selling of schemes. I know of at least one v large firm which ended up paying out a huge figure on an out of court settlement because of it

[Newbee0418]

Does anyone think missold umbrellas could be the next ppi style compensation industry?

I suppose the umbrella / schemes will have most likely pheonixed but some of the largest recruitment companies in the world pushed these schemes for back handers.

It definitely should be! We were all sold a pup! Full of promises and 'no need to worry'.... I hope there is some sort of compensation industry follows in the near future, and yes we were all stupid enough to get sucked in!

[Togoodtobetrue]

Does anyone think missold umbrellas could be the next ppi style compensation industry?

I suppose the umbrella / schemes will have most likely pheonixed but some of the largest recruitment companies in the world pushed these schemes for back handers.

[MayMadness]

Here is a starter for ten...

Sent: 11 November 2013
Subject: AML information


Hi,

Further to our brief chat, I have put together a comparison of net income return with AML versus your limited company. I have based the information on a rough estimated day rate of around £x. I've built into this approx £x p.a of expenses and around £x p.a for current accountancy fees you may have. Please note the higher your current expenses, the less attractive our quote is in comparison. If your current expenses are lower than £x p.a then our product gives you an even higher percentage return in comparison to your current remuneration. If my presumption of these expenses is way out, please let me know and I can amend the calculations.

I have attached a document outlining our return and in addition a brief overview below of our PCC (Partners Collective Company) solution for Contractors.


AML has a wealth of experience in providing efficient remuneration strategies for professionals, consultants, freelancers and contract workers which maximises their take home pay in a safe and compliant manner. Our services are supported by leading counsel opinions and provide a complete administration solution saving you both time and money. All our employees are dedicated to providing excellent levels of service, with payments processed on time, every time. We employ our own in-house tax experts and work closely with leading Tax Counsel and Employment Lawyers to ensure our contracts and remuneration planning are always fully compliant with current UK legislation.

AML maximises your income and can be more tax advantageous as well as more convenient than an umbrella company, PAYE or your own limited company. Once you join AML as a member, we will work with your agency or client to arrange the contract for your services. We raise all invoices on either a weekly or monthly basis and we take full responsibility for debt collection. Once we receive the money from your agency or client, we immediately process and arrange for payment to be transferred to your bank account usually on the same day.

Our service ensures you take home more pay, whilst also saving time and money.

* Take home over 80% of contract value
* We handle all your paperwork from contract negotiation through to payment process and debtor collection
* Regular Payment Cycles
* Fast and easy sign up process (can be done same day)
* Tax return service completed at the year-end for you

ADDITIONAL BENEFITS

* AML provide business insurances including Professional Indemnity of up to £5million
* There are no joining or leaving fees, and total flexibility on contract periods
* Access provided to our online contractor portal, providing you real time information to track your invoices and payments.
* Supported by leading Tax and Employment Counsel Opinion confirming that the service is fully compliant with current UK legislation


I hope the above is of interest to you. I'm more than happy to have a chat in more detail should you be interested. In the meantime, if you have any questions please do not hesitate to call me on my direct line.

Nice... We need more and your recollection of events. Also possible history going back prior to 1999. I am happy to make contact as soon as I can.


Thank you and keep it coming.

[Newbee0418]

Info

Keep those stories coming. Also detail (if you can remember) on how they 'sold' it to you. Imagine being a new contractor/business owner and starting off. You want a legit way to run your company. You call and you listen...Were you told details or 'These are two option you can choose A or B..." What was your mind set back then.


So we need to get the MP's/Media and anyone willing to listen the history of what you were told about the scheme (such as being used pre-99 whether they are actual facts or not) but also your history and state of mind when you engaged in that contractor / seller interaction

In other news...
https://www.politicshome.com/news/uk...overnment-must

Here is a starter for ten...

Sent: 11 November 2013
Subject: AML information


Hi,

Further to our brief chat, I have put together a comparison of net income return with AML versus your limited company. I have based the information on a rough estimated day rate of around £x. I've built into this approx £x p.a of expenses and around £x p.a for current accountancy fees you may have. Please note the higher your current expenses, the less attractive our quote is in comparison. If your current expenses are lower than £x p.a then our product gives you an even higher percentage return in comparison to your current remuneration. If my presumption of these expenses is way out, please let me know and I can amend the calculations.

I have attached a document outlining our return and in addition a brief overview below of our PCC (Partners Collective Company) solution for Contractors.


AML has a wealth of experience in providing efficient remuneration strategies for professionals, consultants, freelancers and contract workers which maximises their take home pay in a safe and compliant manner. Our services are supported by leading counsel opinions and provide a complete administration solution saving you both time and money. All our employees are dedicated to providing excellent levels of service, with payments processed on time, every time. We employ our own in-house tax experts and work closely with leading Tax Counsel and Employment Lawyers to ensure our contracts and remuneration planning are always fully compliant with current UK legislation.

AML maximises your income and can be more tax advantageous as well as more convenient than an umbrella company, PAYE or your own limited company. Once you join AML as a member, we will work with your agency or client to arrange the contract for your services. We raise all invoices on either a weekly or monthly basis and we take full responsibility for debt collection. Once we receive the money from your agency or client, we immediately process and arrange for payment to be transferred to your bank account usually on the same day.

Our service ensures you take home more pay, whilst also saving time and money.

* Take home over 80% of contract value
* We handle all your paperwork from contract negotiation through to payment process and debtor collection
* Regular Payment Cycles
* Fast and easy sign up process (can be done same day)
* Tax return service completed at the year-end for you

ADDITIONAL BENEFITS

* AML provide business insurances including Professional Indemnity of up to £5million
* There are no joining or leaving fees, and total flexibility on contract periods
* Access provided to our online contractor portal, providing you real time information to track your invoices and payments.
* Supported by leading Tax and Employment Counsel Opinion confirming that the service is fully compliant with current UK legislation


I hope the above is of interest to you. I'm more than happy to have a chat in more detail should you be interested. In the meantime, if you have any questions please do not hesitate to call me on my direct line.

[MayMadness]

Keep those stories coming. Also detail (if you can remember) on how they 'sold' it to you. Imagine being a new contractor/business owner and starting off. You want a legit way to run your company. You call and you listen...Were you told details or 'These are two option you can choose A or B..." What was your mind set back then.


So we need to get the MP's/Media and anyone willing to listen the history of what you were told about the scheme (such as being used pre-99 whether they are actual facts or not) but also your history and state of mind when you engaged in that contractor / seller interaction

In other news...
https://www.politicshome.com/news/uk...overnment-must

[GreenMirror]

As with most people we were sucked in when ir35 first came in and screwed up running your own co. Even my account went out of business.

I am sure part of the original sales pitch was that some MPs were using loan schemes pre 1999. Unfortunately I cannot find this info. Seems to me it would explain the timing of this, 20 years later....

I heard MPs were using DTA. Montpelier then got a QC opinion saying that it could be used for contractors - if the contractor/client contract was tightly specified. Which Montpelier ignored and sold the contractors a pup. HMRC falsely believed they had to change the law retrospectively to stop him. But they never did. They only needed IR35.

[me206et]

The LC goes back to 1999. Hence HMRC were aware of schemes back in 1999. And there are still victims being suckered in every day.

As with most people we were sucked in when ir35 first came in and screwed up running your own co. Even my account went out of business.

I am sure part of the original sales pitch was that some MPs were using loan schemes pre 1999. Unfortunately I cannot find this info. Seems to me it would explain the timing of this, 20 years later....

[GreenMirror]

Sam Meadows of Telegraph thinks loan schemes were in use in the 90’s!

He needs to have a look around at what’s happening now as they are still very much in use.

The LC goes back to 1999. Hence HMRC were aware of schemes back in 1999. And there are still victims being suckered in every day.

[MayMadness]

Sam Meadows of Telegraph thinks loan schemes were in use in the 90’s!

He needs to have a look around at what’s happening now as they are still very much in use.

Perhaps we need engage in a collective 'history/Myth' session.

In our experience...We were told that the schemes were originally put in place by Thatcher's govt in the 80's. And were used by a select group of people but grew as word got out and nature of employment changed or vice versa for the latter. At any rate, this came from various authoritarian sources that were initially contacted and amongst fellow contractors at that point in time. Perhaps this is all BS but...

Is there anyway that he could investigate that and the legislation?

and just us importantly....what were others told?

Anyone interested in sharing on or off the forum? This may be very very important to show that there is a shared common experience that can not be put down to 'ahh, you were just greedy'. Those stories really need to be heard.

[Togoodtobetrue]

Sam Meadows of Telegraph thinks loan schemes were in use in the 90’s!

He needs to have a look around at what’s happening now as they are still very much in use.

[MayMadness]

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/tax/news...n-contractors/

Thank you for this.
I do not know whether the following link would help people write in about their experience and asking for it to be investigated further.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/contact-us/editorial/

I would also suggest, writing to Telegraph, Guardian or any other news outlet you deem fit. This would be a similar letter that you would to HMRC and MP's. Again...let them know in detail your suffering and if fitting...how you first got involved.

For instance, in our situation we had contacted HMRC and several accounting professionals and was given the clear from all of them.

I would say the BBC but not sure how receptive they would be.