Settlement groups - common purpose?

[Rob79]

Are you sure they have public opinion on their side? Most of the intelligent people I speak to regarding taxation think that we, the public are part of an extortion racket!

I agree with you that these groups are stronger together.

Yes, I'm pretty convinced that HMRC has public opinion on its side.

They have been very successful in getting well paid public names in the press with stories of tax avoidance. It's also a fact that many uninformed (in tax matters) people see no distinction between Starbucks paying very little (legitimately) in the UK and groups of modestly affluent people seeking to shave a few points off their liability.

It's like the old joke about Churchill and Lady Astor.

Churchill, "Would you sleep with me for £5?"
Astor "Certainly not!"
Churchill "How about £1m?"
Astor "I might, but what do you think I am?"
Churchill "We've established what you are, now we're negotiating a price"

Morally there is no difference between paying a plumber £20, cash in hand that you know he's not going to declare, and arranging a series of offshore companies to remove UK liability by the million. The latter just costs more to do.

[dirk]

Are you sure they have public opinion on their side? Most of the intelligent people I speak to regarding taxation think that we, the public are part of an extortion racket!

I agree with you that these groups are stronger together.

[Rob79]

You will never ever get HMRC to settle. Its a fight to the death. And at the moment HMRC are well ahead.

HMRC will settle for the "right amount of tax" because they are obliged to. They know this and hence the various (ungenerous at the moment) settlement offers.

Settling with a bit less public fuss and exposure happens all the time.

Are HMRC ahead?

They have no clear Court decision that can be applied widely. They have been defeated twice on a high profile scheme. They are making settlement offers. They have limited data. They arguably have limited understanding.

Equally, they control the timetable and can be forced into action only with the application of funds to the lawyers. They do have public opinion on their side.

Ahead, yes perhaps. The secret therefore is to recover some of the ground.

[Rob79]

Without being a member of each group, which I assume you're not, how do you know where they are in their individual processes and plans?

Because the schemes used are different, the people who used them have different motives and objectives, the enthusiasm of HMRC varies from scheme to scheme, some have information available, some not, some have settlement offers open, some want to "fight to the death".

[Scruff]

Why not found a group called PCG? Then charge everyone £180 per annum to join... The name is now available I believe since the previous incumbents rebranding exercise...

[BrilloPad]

You will never ever get HMRC to settle. Its a fight to the death. And at the moment HMRC are well ahead.

[PeterF]

Understood.

I think that they should because they are stronger together and HMRC's overall plan is always to pick off stragglers and the injured.

I'd like to invite any settlement group co-ordinators to contact me (PM or I'll give out an e-mail address separate from the forum if required) and I'll start by composing a list of which groups exist, where they are in their process and what is being planned.

Does that make sense?

Without being a member of each group, which I assume you're not, how do you know where they are in their individual processes and plans?

[JustinTime]

Understood.

I think that they should because they are stronger together and HMRC's overall plan is always to pick off stragglers and the injured.

I'd like to invite any settlement group co-ordinators to contact me (PM or I'll give out an e-mail address separate from the forum if required) and I'll start by composing a list of which groups exist, where they are in their process and what is being planned.

Does that make sense?

Ask them to pony up £50, and then start an internet based trade association.

[Rob79]

..they should, but they don't.

Understood.

I think that they should because they are stronger together and HMRC's overall plan is always to pick off stragglers and the injured.

I'd like to invite any settlement group co-ordinators to contact me (PM or I'll give out an e-mail address separate from the forum if required) and I'll start by composing a list of which groups exist, where they are in their process and what is being planned.

Does that make sense?

[jbryce]

This section of the website has details of perhaps 6 or more settlement groups.

I think that the NTRT thread might also have some?

Do these groups ever share information or views?

Should they?

..they should, but they don't.

[Rob79]

This section of the website has details of perhaps 6 or more settlement groups.

I think that the NTRT thread might also have some?

Do these groups ever share information or views?

Should they?